English Transcript of the episode with Loco Locass : Amour oral

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Please note : This is an English translation of an automated (yet perfected) AI transcript. It is provided for informational purposes only. While we did our best to capture the vibe, automated tools can sometimes twist spoken words—especially with our local Quebec slang! For official or accurate reference, please consult the original audio episode.

Hugo Lachance: We are here on February 9, 2026, broadcasting from Montreal. And today, we are going to talk about "Amour Oral" between men... and no, we won't be talking about the sexual practice, but rather the essential album by Loco Locass on L'Album Podcast.

Hey, hello everyone! Before properly introducing my guest, I want to thank our new subscribers on social media. Come join us, it’s a quick gesture that doesn’t take any time, and it’s truly important for a podcast like mine. So, go subscribe: YouTube, Blue Sky, Instagram... you know the drill, it’s a small gesture, but it really, really means a lot.

Also, I want to thank my sponsor: so, this episode is sponsored by the Hopéra Microbrewery. It’s a microbrewery located in Jonquière, so there is a restaurant-pub on Saint-Dominique Street, and also in the industrial park, there is the Shop. It’s a factory where they do their brewing, and there is a little pub set up inside. It’s really cool!

You can check it out over there, and you can also check out certain artifacts from Quebec bands: GrimSkunk, WD-40, Mononc' Serge, etc. You’ll be welcomed by the staff at the Shop, who are really, really friendly. So, I thank Vlad and his team once again. Go taste their products too, they are really good. For real, they are truly people who are involved in the community, so we shout them out.

You like my work? You want to support the podcast? Well, you can do so through a spontaneous donation or a monthly donation via PayPal. If you are listening to the audio version, well head over to lalbumpodcast.ca, otherwise on video, you have a link in the description.

Hugo Lachance: Biz! Salut. Welcome to L'Album Podcast.

Biz: Salut Hugo. Thank you, thank you for the invitation. This is very, very cool. I'm really happy, we finally managed to see each other.

Hugo Lachance: We are here to talk, obviously, about your album "Amour Oral" which is celebrating its 20th anniversary.

Biz: Yeah, it’s still pretty mind-blowing, isn't it? Yeah, that... you know, I never listen back to my own stuff, but for the occasion, I listened to the album again, and it really showed how much time has passed, and it obviously brought back a ton of memories.

SEGMENT: Presentation of the Artist

Hugo Lachance: Well, I understand. Listen, for me too, it’s a significant moment. It’s an album that is important in my life as well. Uh, but before moving on to the album, because we are obviously going to listen to each of the songs, before that, we are going to do a bit of history and start the way I do with all my guests: I ask the same five questions. So, Biz, Sébastien Fréchette, where is he from?

Biz: From Quebec City. Quebec City until I was 18. I have roots on the North Shore because my parents used to live in Sept-Îles and Baie-Comeau. And so, Quebec City, Upper Town. After that, I studied for 5 years in Trois-Rivières. And after that, I moved to Montreal. But at that point, the westward migration had to stop, otherwise I would have ended up in Ottawa. I didn't feel like it.

Hugo Lachance: Indeed. What is your childhood album, the furthest back you can remember?

Biz: Hm... Le Rêve du Diable, which is an album... a folk group. Yeah, spontaneously I'd say that one. Let's say... Yeah, that goes back to maybe 3 or 4 years old.

Hugo Lachance: OK, cool! And your teenage album? The one that was formative?

Biz: Well... MC Solaar, Prose Combat. For me, that's major, because it’s the album—when we heard that back home during a party at my parents' place, in the basement... my crew of friends and I listened to a lot of rap, almost exclusively rap, and in American English. Then at some point, someone puts this on, and right there, it blew our minds.

Because it showed that we could do it in French, and it didn't sound like RBO or "the pope of rap," you know? This wasn't a joke, making rap in French: it was possible, with the right tonic accents, with impeccable production. You didn't have to be a gangster selling drugs to make rap either. So that unlocked a lot of things. But otherwise, I'd say before that, it was more cégep. But in high school, I was very much into metal. Yeah, I was... so I'd say probably some Iron Maiden.

Hugo Lachance: OK. But it’s cool that you mention it because MC Solaar, even for us who were also a crew of punks-metalheads, and... but MC Solaar, we loved it immediately in our crew, because it’s brilliant, it’s well-done, it’s... I think anyone who knows and loves music and is sensitive to intelligence, MC Solaar, you can't bypass that.

Biz: It’s clear. It’s clear. You can’t, you can’t, you can’t deny that. And that being said, there are also a lot of links between metal and even punk and rap, you know? Links that were outright embodied with Aerosmith-Run-D.M.C., with Cypress Hill, Anthrax-Public Enemy... exactly.

That’s what made Body Count, exactly, Body Count which was the fusion of that. So, even if at first glance it looks so far removed from American black ghetto music in the early 80s, in any case, compared to whiter metal, in the end, these people recognized each other in a sort of brotherhood.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yes! Listen, for me that was a moment... "Bring the Noise," Anthrax and Public Enemy, for me that was a pivotal moment in my life. I tripped out so much! That's it. You know, it makes you say: "OK, I have the right to be friends with my buddy who listens to rap or metal."

Biz: Exactly. Oh yes, because it’s... it’s much less so now, but back then it was very divided, it was compartmentalized. Yeah.

Hugo Lachance: OK. We're gonna talk a bit about that anyway. And what was playing in your parents' car or at home?

Biz: In the car, not much because there was no radio... or even... there was just a radio actually, there were no cassettes back then. But at home, what was playing on the turntable was... I'm trying to remember the old stuff... well, there was... there was Dire Straits, there was...

Hugo Lachance: OK.

Biz: OK. Well, Thriller when it came out! That one, I wore out the record so much flipping it over and over again. Uh, yeah, it’s a defining album for our generation. It could come out now, and the production quality from Quincy Jones is so mind-blowing that it’s... it will... that's it! It’s a classic, as they say, with the visuals too.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah. Especially all the leopards, that part I didn't quite understand, but indeed, the video for "Thriller" which is... indeed, when that played back then, during the Nuit des Vidéoclips, it was like: "Oh! OK."

Biz: Otherwise for me, the first, first, first record I bought was Piece of Mind by Iron Maiden, because of the cover. I had that in 5th grade. My parents, what did they listen to? Listen, other stuff, you know, from the 80s... ABBA... I remember that. Otherwise, yeah, it stays pretty much around that, popular music from the 80s let's say.

Hugo Lachance: And at what point did you realize that music was going to be fundamental in your life?

Biz: Fundamental... well very early. For me, from the furthest back I can remember, I've always loved listening to music. From the furthest back I can remember, I've always sung poorly myself, so it never crossed my mind that I could end up as a pop singer based on my description in the Union des artistes. On the other hand, you know, I played drums when I was in Secondary 4.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK.

Biz: Yeah. And incidentally, it was François Pérusse who was working at Contact Musique in Quebec City who sold me my drum kit.

Hugo Lachance: Oh wow, OK!

Biz: He was a student of my father's at Garneau, and he had told me... my father had told me: "Well, a young student who works at Contact Musique, we're gonna go buy your drums there."

Hugo Lachance: That's cool! Who was a bass player for Luc De Larochellière at the time?

Biz: Yes, indeed! Yes, otherwise with Denis Talbot as well on Musique Plus in his game, the quiz, I don't know if you remember, on Musique Plus.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yes! He made music. Yeah, for sure.

Biz: But otherwise, when I was a kid I listened to folk music. And when I was 6 years old, I did... that was the first time I went on stage because I... there was at the cottage in Saint-Ubalde, so in Portneuf, there was a... at the Potato Festival every year, there was a folk music orchestra that put on shows.

So it gathered fiddle players from the village, storytellers, traditional songs. My father played the harmonica so he had been integrated into the orchestra, and as for me, well I sang a song by Breton Cyr, "Des snelles et des pommettes," and I played the spoons.

So I was 6 years old and I did an audition, they integrated me into the orchestra, and well, I made 60 bucks per show. That was the first time I went up on a stage, and that, I liked it. But I don't think I had the urge to make music starting from that moment. But otherwise, I listened to a lot of it, all kinds, and at some point... that's it, when MC Solaar arrived, then... yeah, then Bat and I started writing rap in French.

Hugo Lachance: Cool! And that’s when you knew you could do something with it? You answered the next question basically, which was: what was your first instrument? So there were the spoons, singing poorly, and the drums?

Biz: Exactly. You understand correctly: I have everything it takes to do rap, I sing poorly and I've got the beat!

Hugo Lachance: That's good! But by the way, thanks for welcoming me to your place, it’s a pleasure. It’s really cool. With the podcast, I travel to people's places, artists' homes, it’s quite a perk.

Biz: Yeah, and for me, well I don't need to put my boots on and I can stay at home doing my dishes while waiting. And we also shout out... but the other two guys, Batlam OK... who was supposed to be here but he’s shooting a film, so unfortunately he won't be here.

The Wikipedia Ordeal

Hugo Lachance: Uh, so now we're gonna do the Wikipedia ordeal. So: Sébastien Fréchette was born on December 8, '72 in Quebec City. Biz possesses multiple facets. He was a counselor at Camp Trois-Saumons in the Chaudière-Appalaches region, then head of the cafeteria at camp Odyssée-Minogami in Mauricie, where he welcomed the young teenagers responsible for cleaning the cafeteria.

He was also head of counselors at the Colonie des Grèves in Contrecœur. That is your Wikipedia!

Biz: Yeah, that’s a lot of responsibilities! Everything that’s there is true, yes. And you know, it’s a... summer camp for me was truly foundational in my life, because when I started there during cégep... first year of cégep, I didn't know what to do with my summer, I barely knew what to do with my life, and I was rather misanthropic.

Then when I got to the camp, through taking care of the kids, I tripped out. I met two of my best friends, who are still my best friends to this day. And you know, taking care of kids, tripping out in the woods, hiking... that's when I became a humanist. So I reformatted myself, which is pretty rare in a lifetime. Uh, and I didn't know it, but during the summer, we... I was always composing camp songs, singing them myself, so taking the floor in front of 300-400 youth, and also composing silly songs about "we're going into the woods and making a track." And in doing so, I was learning my trade without knowing it.

Hugo Lachance: OK, talking to people and composing tracks... so now we come to Loco Locass. So, this is still in the Wikipedia ordeal: in cégep, Batlam meets Sébastien Fréchette, with whom he strikes up a friendship. After discovering the music of French rapper MC Solaar, the two decide to form the group Locos Loquaces in '95.

Biz: Yeah. And we had put an S on Loco, and we used the original spelling Q-U-A-C-E-S. And Chafiik, when he saw that, he put the H inside the S, and he added two S's to make it Locass, to make it not "Locos Loquaces," but to make it Loco Locass. Like we say, "not the Metallica," to truly become a band, an entity.

Hugo Lachance: You met in cégep, and how... that's it, we were talking earlier about Solaar. So how did you meet Batlam?

Biz: We... first of all, we went to the same elementary school in Quebec City, which was the Anne-Hébert school. But since he was a year older, which means 20,000 years in teenage years, in elementary school years, we were distant, we knew we existed. Then we sort of found each other at the end of high school, and in cégep. We found each other at Cégep Garneau. And I was doing student radio, I wrote in the paper. There was a poetry journal I wrote in, and he read my poems and said: "This guy looks cool, he writes well."

Hugo Lachance: Ah, that’s cool!

Biz: Then we found each other around a radio show I hosted with some friends, which was called "Colocage" precisely. So "Loco Locass" started as a radio show in cégep.

Hugo Lachance: Ah, OK! OK.

Biz: So I always say when I go see kids in high schools: well in cégep, the most important subject is extracurricular activities, because that’s where you fulfill yourself, where you meet people who trip out on the same things as you, and that’s where you can actually find your trade. Practicing it, in any case.

So we played music, we said silly things, we had characters. My host character was Biz... hence the name that stuck, OK. And we had the privileged time slot of Friday at 4 PM, where we received hashish deliveries. So we could test the merchandise before starting the weekend, you know?

And also a very important thing with Batlam and the radio friends: we played the Dictionary Game, which is a game where you have to invent definitions. And so, we played that for nights on end, drinking and tripping out... we were inside the language, immersed in the language. So you see, it’s a connection that is truly based on language and the interest in language, speech, and reflection.

And when we heard MC Solaar after that... that was in '95 after the referendum... and we said to ourselves: "But we came so close... what is missing? What are Quebecers missing?" Confidence and pride, in the end. And yeah, absolutely, to decolonize ourselves like all colonized peoples have done. And we said: "Well, rap could be a good idea, because it’s based on speech, on making demands."

Hugo Lachance: But you come from metal originally?

Biz: Yeah.

Hugo Lachance: And then you decided to found a rap group?

Biz: Yeah, that’s to say, I come from metal but in the 90s, it was the golden age of American rap, you know? So I listened to a lot of Cypress Hill, N.W.A., Public Enemy, whose political commitment I admired. Yeah, it’s good... Public Enemy! Flavor Flav's voice and Chuck D... I see a lot of myself in him because he says: "I don't do..." He doesn't do freestyle or battles or anything, he says: "For me, I have to write. I don't improvise, I do theater," you know?

And I've always found myself in that. I admire guys who are capable of doing duels and improvising. Personally, I'm incapable. But Chuck D is a guy who writes, who is politically engaged and doesn't say silly things... he needs to write before rapping. Well, me too. So I'm in good company, you know.

Hugo Lachance: OK. I have a little anecdote about Public Enemy. I discovered Public Enemy through Anthrax, but at the same time, my cousin Hélène had ordered a cassette and she thought Public Enemy was punk. She listened to it, she goes: "It’s rap," and she gave it to me. I ended up with it, listened to it, and it was a revelation as well. I really tripped out!

Biz: Yes, it’s not punk in the musical genre sense, but it’s punk in spirit. When you have a punk spirit, you can be open to a lot of things. Exactly! Ah, that’s cool.

Uh, and besides, the punk spirit, in our case, served to start making Loco Locass. Because we had nothing. How did the first texts start? It was after the referendum, so at Christmas, between Christmas and New Year's. I was at my parents' place during the holidays—I was studying in Trois-Rivières at the time—and Batlam was at his parents' place, he was in Montreal, at the National School.

Then he comes to my place in the afternoon, he had composed a rap text that was a response to an open letter by a young girl who says... who had titled her open letter "Quebec is killing me," OK, in '95. And so she was saying: "It’s too small, it feels stuffy... I'm tired, I'm moving to the States," a bit whiny. So we kind of responded to that, OK?

In that first text, I listen to it, I thought it was interesting and all that. I was saying: "Is there room? I'll start," and then I added a verse and all that. So that was the first text by Loco Locass. Back then, there wasn't even any music. In '95, we didn't even have a beat, actually.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah. Well we're gonna talk about that, I'll bring you to that.

Biz: So that was the first thing from Loco, it was this bad text with which we never did anything because it wasn't good.

Hugo Lachance: Ah, but it takes one! It takes one.

Biz: Yes. It’s like the famous track when you have a... well yes! You know, it’s like for an architect: the guy who built the Notre-Dame Cathedral in Paris didn't start with a cathedral, he started with a birdhouse. It’s always like that.

Hugo Lachance: Very cool. Uh, now we were talking about nicknames. Basically, Ricard was named Snou?

Biz: Yeah. Him, well Snou, that’s still what I call him. He has a first name and a last name with a particle. So it’s... his real name is SNU from Batlam, OK. So Batlam is his last name, and when it’s Batlam's close friends, we call him SN, SN.

Hugo Lachance: OK. In '99, he associates with the rapper Chafiik (Mathieu Farhoud-Dionne) and the group becomes Loco Locass in the form we know it today?

Biz: Yeah. And then when we... it’s because before meeting Chafiik, we were in Quebec City and we... there, starting from the first bad text, we made others, including "Langage-toi" and "Malaise malaisant" which remained on the Manifestif album. But we still had nothing, no musical backing to perform them.

So we did them a cappella at Poetry Nights, or when there was a drummer, he'd play drums and we'd rap over it. Then at some point, we had a technician friend who worked at Méduse, which is an artistic complex in Quebec City, and there was a studio. So we say: "Can we go do something for 2 days in the studio? We don't really know what, we have texts."

And we do... so Batlam and I made a little demo of four experimental tracks with beatboxing. And I would make scratches on my coat and we called that DJ Jacket. And it’s truly... it’s truly rap, but for us, it was the first time we were in a studio. We could redo the take just the same, we messed around with the tracks just with beatboxing, you know?

So we didn't know how, but we had the desire to do something. So we did it, and that was the first recorded thing. That was in '96, I think. Then when we, after that, we both moved to Montreal, and we needed a producer, a guy, a DJ to make music.

And Chafiik, he already had a band, a rock band at the time. He wanted to do rap because he found it was a genre that was new; for a rock composer... you pretty much always have the same three chords. So he wanted to go see elsewhere with sampling. So he was looking for MCs. A mutual friend introduced us.

"I know some rappers, I know a DJ." So he had us meet and... that was a beautiful meeting. I remember it very well, it was at his place, his mother's place actually, in Outremont. And he was making the music for a film at that time. So he says: "I have half an hour to give you." Damn, he's Dr. Dre, you know? It’s like: "This is gonna go well." Yeah.

So we arrive, we didn't know each other, we have a few texts, 7-8 texts let's say. We throw them out there. Instantly, he tinkers with some beats, OK. And for me it was like: "Oh!" I felt like I was getting a custom-tailored suit made for me, because otherwise I was rapping over Cypress Hill, OK, yeah, yeah.

So you listen to Manifestif, even "Langage-toi," it sounds a lot like B-Real—the phrasing, the words... so it happened... and I'm there, I'm there... and you know it’s nasal. Uh, so that was... inevitably, if you rap in his track, well you're gonna take on his flow a bit and his intonation but in French. So... but we learn everything through mimicry as well, somewhere.

Hugo Lachance: Completely.

Biz: The great painters all copied the great painters in museums. That’s always how it... you just have to digest it and break free.

Hugo Lachance: Exactly.

Biz: But so from there, I was like: "OK!" It’s the first time I can have a real beat for myself with the tempo I want and no words over it, and there I can rap my stuff. Then Chaf hears that, he said: "Yeah cool, we're gonna make a record. In a year we're making a record." Then we hugged each other like when a team just won the Cup this year, and: "Cool, we just found each other, you know?" Wow!

And that's what happened. For a year and a half we worked on Manifestif, that was in '98. Then in 2000, that very winter, at Christmas '99, we had made the Manifestif demo. And are there demos that exist of that? Did you commercialize a demo? Well, that's to say, it’s the album in black and white, yes, yes, we sold it.

Because what happened was that we won the Francouvertes in 2000 ahead of the Cowboys Fringants. Yeah, we're getting to that, by a vote. And following the contest, well we had our demo that we thought we were going to have to re-record entirely when we signed with a record company. But ultimately we signed with Audiogram, and they said: "We're changing nothing in there."

That's the punk spirit right there. Yeah, yeah, the DIY. Yeah truly. We had a 60-dollar SM58. Yeah, that's it, exactly. Computer and in the living room, like here. When the phone rang, we had to redo the take. It was really, really... Chaf was learning his trade as a producer too. So it was truly punk in spirit, Manifestif, with what it has that's good and less good, you know.

Personally, I find it’s a bit of teenage shouting, and I find there are too many words in Manifestif, but that's my personal taste. But at the time it worked big time. And when we won the Francouvertes contest, the record was reviewed by Éric Parazelli in Voir, and in Ici, as... considered a Record of the Week.

Uh, so we were like: "But wait, it’s just a demo!" And then, for the record stores, it was panic because everyone arrived with the Voir: "I want this record!", but nobody had ever heard of it. So we pressed some. I was cutting the cover on my kitchen table with X-Acto knives, and we were truly making the album ourselves.

Chaf would burn 10 at a time in a tower, he’d get up at night to... like a baker with a batch! And we had that in our backpacks, we went to Archambault and Renaud-Bray, and to record stores to bring 10-20 on consignment... burned CDs!

Yeah, no, no, it was... it couldn't be more punk than that. And at some point, we couldn't keep up with demand so we had them printed. Had them pressed... pressed in a real factory, but it remained the original living room sound, OK? Wow! Yeah, it’s very cool.

Hugo Lachance: We're gonna continue with just a portrait from Wikipedia: so the members of the group are three people passionate about the French language who integrate poetic and committed lyrics into their rhythmic music on a rap baseline, refining the art of Koubraüss. Yeah, what is that, Koubraüss?

Biz: Koubraüss is a word we invented because, you know, when we played with words, it also meant inventing them, and incorporating a bit of "Koubraüss" into the mix. And Koubraüss came from the universe of Stanley Kubrick, which means a bit strange and unsettling. It’s a notion that Freud himself thought about... upon which he reflected: the uncanny.

And you know when you see Stanley Kubrick's shots in The Shining with the tricycle rolling on the carpet and it’s strange and unsettling... it’s a bit of that kind of offset. And it can mean also in our universe... we often contrasted it with perfect. Someone who is perfect, you know it’s like: it’s someone who wants to be too perfect and ends up being clinical.

Yeah, a bit of a précieux ridicule if you will. So the opposite of that would be someone who is... that's it! OK. A known inside joke! It’s very good.

Hugo Lachance: Now I found an article, Sylvain Cormier, Le Devoir, February 11, 2000, about the finale of the Francouvertes. Yeah, I think that's the oldest article I found regarding Loco Locass.

"Then followed the Cowboys Fringants, an irresistible band of country-folk-trash. Good business of a real party all night long, but also something to make you think between two frantic western rigodons. They hadn't come alone: a horde of fans was scattered in every corner of the Zest to belt out the refrains of these Marcel Galarneau, Maurice au Bistro, and other suburbs. There reigned, as one might say, a hell of an atmosphere that smelled furiously of victory. But look out: a twist. It goes to show how much the hip-hop trio impressed. Literally snatched first place from the Fringants, striking harder and harder each time, adding musician after musician until filling the stage in a powerful and winning crescendo."

"One couldn't deny the impact of the lyrics either. These guys have an alert and urgent verve. In the best years of the Empire, I had never had so much the impression of witnessing the emergence of artists not only capable, but already in the process of renewing the ambient landscape of song from here." Quite something, eh? It gives a good idea indeed.

Biz: Because for me, when I heard the Cowboys' crowd singing "Marcel Galarneau," I said to myself: "It’s over. We're playing for second place," because the public had 50% of the vote. It was epic. People who were on the jury told me later that it had been a fight to the death, practically, between Loco and the Cowboys, and by a single vote it swung to our side.

But in the end, all's well that ends well, because the Cowboys released Break syndical after that and they took off. They didn't need first place. As for us, since we weren't known and we were starting out, we needed it more. Then our respective fans poked fun at each other for a while until we reunited. But we've always admired them, and we're always with them.

Hugo Lachance: That was a hell of a night! Because as you say, afterward the Cowboys took off but you guys also cleared the path, you know, for the hip-hop aspect in Quebec.

Biz: We participated indeed in clearing the path, in opening the ears of Quebecers. But you know, along with us, there was obviously Dubmatique who, to this day—hard to comprehend—has the best-selling album, the best-selling rap album in Quebec. The second was Amour Oral.

After that, you had Muzion, Sans Pression, Manu Militari, Taktika in Quebec City... you know, there was still a scene that existed but we were rather on the fringes at the beginning. Yeah.

Hugo Lachance: But it was the first scene in Quebec I think? Unless the others were... I know Félix B. Desfossés did, wrote books on that, on the hip-hop scene in Quebec, but more in the 80s.

Biz: Well there it’s more anglophone, 80s. Francophone, it’s like the... you guys are like the first, second wave? Yeah, for me the first real Quebec rap, if you want, the proto-history of rap queb, I would put that with M.R.F. (Mouvement Rap Francophone), OK, mid-90s.

Then after that you have K.C.L.M.N.O.P. with "Ta gueule," which for me remains year zero, the Jesus Christ, the milestone of: there we have real rap, no joke, and which worked even in France.

Hugo Lachance: It’s not Lucien Francœur.

Biz: No, that's it. It was real rap with the Quebec accent, with joual. And after that indeed you arrive in Montreal with R.D.P., there was Traumaturge, there was Le Cerveau, there was finally... and well obviously Muzion and Sans Pression. For me, when I heard "L'étage souterrain," I saw the video on Musique Plus, I said to myself: "Oh! OK."

To this day, if you say: "We're sending a track of rap queb to Mars in a rocket," I put "L'étage souterrain." For me it remains the emblematic track of Quebec rap. And I said to myself: "OK, the competition is extremely strong here." I—we were in the middle of writing "Je suis là je suis là" then, and all the... the Manifestif.

So that competition in rap is very strong. The emulation—sometimes dumb because it ends with guns—but when it’s healthy, that emulation pulls everyone upward. And we heard "L'étage souterrain" and we said: "We can't show up halfway. We have to try to match that." So that was very stimulating, those years back then.

Hugo Lachance: OK cool! That’s super. Exactly, we're gonna talk about it. I like to make a portrait of the musical scene, you know, to put people in context. So you guys started around '95 pretty much?

Biz: Yeah, first text in '95. Good.

Portrait of the 1995 Music Scene

Hugo Lachance: So in '95. Female performer of the year was Lara Fabian, male was Roch Voisine. Group of the year, there was Beau Dommage, La Bottine Souriante, Les Colocs, Desjardins et l'Abbaye, Zébulon... which one won do you think?

Biz: It must have been Les Colocs?

Hugo Lachance: No, it was Beau Dommage, the return of Beau Dommage. Rock album of the year, there was Éric Lapointe, Obsession, France D'Amour, Richard Desjardins again, Marjo, then Zébulon.

Biz: Well I would put Éric Lapointe with Obsession.

Hugo Lachance: Exactly that! Yeah.

Biz: And yeah, in the category of the ugliest cover in the history of Quebec music, Obsession is a complete failure.

Hugo Lachance: There was Zébulon which was also Richard Desjardins... "Tu m'aimes-tu," that was good too.

Biz: Yes, it’s rock, that's another thing, but yeah exact.

Hugo Lachance: Uh, breakthrough artist of the year, Éric Lapointe nonetheless. Music video director of the year was André Fortin for "La rue principale." Popular song of the year was Céline Dion for "Pour que tu m'aimes encore." Then there was rap too.

Biz: So in the US it was 2Pac, Me Against the World, there was Notorious B.I.G., Tha Dogg Pound, then The Roots. We agree it’s the golden age of American rap?

Hugo Lachance: That's it. And Eminem arriving in the late 80s, late 90s... that’s it right there. It was something!

Biz: Cypress Hill! For me, Black Sunday, that impressed me so much, you know? And I’d say that... the cover looked a bit metal too, you know... but you know those are my classics, you know, that I bought back on vinyl.

But you know, De La Soul, we smoked so many joints to that! This, my kids gave me: Eminem, which I consider his best album... he disowned it, I consider it my favorite.

Hugo Lachance: Relapse?

Biz: No, it’s an album when he was on his pills in depression, and it yielded some damn good songs. This obviously, 2003, a classic of the... exactly, "In da Club." And you see, we were in the middle of making Amour Oral at that moment, and it pulled us upward clearly, because we weren't just in a closed vessel with Quebec anymore.

In the record stores, when you listened to what you wanted to buy in the listening station, there was 50 Cent and Eminem. So you have to sound as good as them, otherwise it doesn't work. Cypress Hill, which is my favorite, Temples of Boom, yes that's very good. Well, Fugees obviously! Something else to be said... how powerful and well-produced it was.

Yeah exactly. And obviously Black Sunday, that’s it! "I Want to Get High"... like that! And that connected with everyone no matter if... they listened to black metal or whatever, because there was... and you know they did some with metal too, a compilation, they re-did their track in metal as well.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, there were compilations, I don't remember what they were called, but you know where metal groups were paired with rap groups. That has always been very... and I didn't suspect it, I discovered it later, but Cypress Hill has the Latino side too, right?

Biz: Yeah, it’s true. So it wasn't just Black American but it was also South American with things in Spanish. You know they said: "Don't you know I'm loco," you know? And "loca" means crazy in Spanish. So there was that, that really... for me I think that’s what made me want to do rap. And MC Solaar allowed me to do rap.

Yeah, OK, OK that’s good. And after that that’s it, we arrive with that but in the meantime there is Manifestif. No, but I find it piles up well. And in France too! In France there was... well, '95 is a foundational year for French rap. It becomes a major social voice.

There was IAM, L'école du micro d'argent is '97, but they started writing in '95 for the period. And obviously there is a Solaar for Prose Combat that we discussed earlier. Yeah, and it’s Solaar and also... it was... I bought that album on Saint-Jean in Quebec City, and I had a little apartment on Frontenac. I listened to it and I remember, I was in the middle of writing "Je suis là je suis là," the lyrics.

Then I listened to that, and then I said: "Oh fuck! Now we're in the Major Leagues." It’s French-language rap in terms of production quality, beat, text, flow... with "La Saga" too you know, which integrated the Wu-Tang. We are of the same... we are capable in French of being as strong as the Americans on every level.

And that, again, also pulled us upward, saying: "OK, we are Quebecers, but as francophones we are capable of making rap as strong as the Americans." Easy!

Hugo Lachance: I get the impression making rap in French than making rock in French or metal in French, to me?

Biz: Well you know Mononc' Serge-Anonymus, that’s excellent, you know? Personally, I don't think it’s easier or harder to do it in Russian or in German, you know? You just have to find the right way to do it. The problem often when people say "it’s harder," or plenty of Quebecers who say: "Ah, I prefer hearing it in English, it’s easier for me."

It’s that you're trying to take French and put it—to force the round peg of French into the square hole of English with the tonic accents, the prosody, and that’s what doesn't work. That’s what gives something fake and difficult.

If you find the key to the tonic accent like MC Solaar did too... after that if you ask me: it’s easier. We did a track in English, with "Rock Rap," which is a sort of experimental track where we said... we imagined our Canadian alter egos called the Crazy Kanucks, who sing the glory of Canada in pure derision.

But for me it was harder to do that than to do a track in French, because I speak in French, I dream in French, I think in French. I mean, it’s not true that it’s easier for me in English. It’s easy to make a bad rap track in English, you copy another one!

That's it. But I think when you find the right way to do it in your language... and essentially, it’s not that complicated: it’s a matter of rapping the way we speak. Yeah! And the first albums of rap queb, late 90s... the guys all had Marseille accents! Because we had listened to L'école du micro d'argent too much.

And when I played with Akhenaton last autumn in Quebec City, and I had the chance to talk to him a bit backstage, I said: "You, you can't imagine the debt Quebec rappers owe to you guys."

"Oh yeah?" "It’s because of you guys that we started making rap here." So rap was born in New York, it went to the West Coast, it crossed over to France (Paris, Marseille), and it came back to Quebec. And in Quebec, I find we have the best of both worlds: we have the lyricism of the French and the beats of America.

So for me... Sans Pression or Muzion once said: "Rap queb is the best rap in the world." Not all rap queb! But when you have good Quebec rap, indeed we have nothing to blush about.

Hugo Lachance: OK. And therefore... and I was saying, I don't know if you know it, but everyone had the Marseille accent in Quebec when we rapped. That is to say the power of the influence.

Biz: Yeah, because the Quebec sound that we... not at all Marseille. That's it. And it wasn't developed yet.

Hugo Lachance: No.

Biz: And you know, those who developed it, I told you through jokes too, but the first is truly K.C.L.M.N.O.P., OK. After that for me it’s Sans Pression who, in "Je peux backer tous mes péchés," has the most beautiful "tabarnak" in rap.

Then Muzion. For me it’s Sans Pression, Muzion... they are the ones who truly established the foundations of rap queb. Muzion had more of the Montreal-Creole-French slang. Sans Pression too because there was Ti-Kid who rapped with him in Creole. And you know, Sans Pression once told me: "I flipped out when I went to Sept-Îles and all the teenagers in Sept-Îles were rapping Ti-Kid's lyrics in Creole."

That’s still the power of what rap can do. It’s saying: "OK, we aren't Haitian but we recognize ourselves in this because a rap group offers it to us."

Hugo Lachance: OK cool! Look, I'll continue: in Quebec precisely, there was Dubmatique, Yvon Krevé, Sans Pression, 2 Faces le Gémeaux, Dream Warriors, Bran Van 3000.

Biz: Yeah, Bran Van nonetheless! It’s international.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, that's it. It hit very hard. Then also Sal-V.I.O., he was in Johnny Go by Jean Leloup?

Biz: Yes, absolutely. Worked a lot with Jean Leloup. And that too, Jean Leloup, we talked about that's it. But Jean Leloup nonetheless, that was on Le Dôme! That rap was very valid in my opinion?

Hugo Lachance: Well there is still a lot of rap too.

Biz: Yeah. There is a phrasing... Jean Leloup has a specific phrasing that can come close to rap. It’s not always sung, it’s declaimed right. Yeah.

DISCOGRAPHY

Hugo Lachance: OK. And we're gonna move on to the discography. I'll name an album and you tell me what that period means for you, well for the group actually. So in 2000, you have Manifestif?

Biz: Yeah. Well Manifestif is the newborn right, you know? It’s the way we presented ourselves to the world with mainly "Je suis là je suis là" as the first single. For me it represents, along with the Colocage... the guys, we were learning to know each other. I knew Batlam but I didn't know Chaf.

So it’s a work partner who became a friend. And essentially my days were: in the morning, I wrote rap lyrics; at noon, I went to the West Island to watch kids for lunch in a school with Batlam; and in the afternoon, we took the metro and went all the way to the Joliette metro station in the East, in Hochelaga at Chaf's place, to work on Manifestif, OK cool! Super.

Hugo Lachance: So it was entirely punk. We absolutely did not know what we were doing with it, you know? And we were in the aftermath of the referendum, everyone was sick and tired of hearing about independence. Nobody knew rap in Quebec outside of Montreal and Quebec City.

Biz: So we said to ourselves: "We're making music for our mother, our grandmother who's gonna buy us a record at Christmas, and that's it." Yeah, yeah, yeah. We couldn't suspect there would be so many people who were going to be interested in what we did.

Hugo Lachance: Ah, I understand! In 2003 you released the EP In vivo?

Biz: Yeah. That, which is a genre... in the end it’s a CD-ROM but it integrated images of a show at the Métropolis. It was like a live album with video elements.

Uh, and it was an interactive CD-ROM in the sense that we had a whole delusion too. This CD, we had imagined it like a secret RCMP file monitoring us. That’s why there were live images... had filmed, and they considered us a danger to Canadian unity.

So that was the whole gimmick. And there was a thing, a delusion around with Riopelle too, where you could make Riopelle's paintings move to the sound of a song about Riopelle. And now all of that is obsolete because you can't read a CDR anymore. But as a CD, when you ran it, it worked as a CD too. There was the song "Super Mario" which was against the ADQ, which was the ancestor of the CAQ. Yeah, OK cool.

Hugo Lachance: And obviously, we're gonna talk about it in detail, but Amour Oral?

Biz: That’s the explosion. That, the second album, it’s make or break. And for us inevitably, it made it and broke everything! It worked very well due to all kinds of circumstances. Yeah, it’s a perfect timing that... what we needed.

And we'll talk about it again, but personally I find it’s the album... it’s Chafiik's favorite in terms of construction, narration, song order, coherence, cohesion within the songs. I listened to it again recently. There are still good tracks that hold up as well.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah?

Biz: Oh yes! Don't worry. This is... I've listened to it four or five times since we planned the interview, and indeed the majority holds up.

Hugo Lachance: Then 2012, Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec !?

Biz: That’s our swan song. It’s the last one we put out, that we proposed, which took 8 years to make for all kinds of reasons. For me it remains my favorite as a spectator. You make me listen to the three records, in this album, I find we are... myself in any case, I am more skillful at composing songs.

Because when I met Chafiik, I didn't know music, and Loco's texts were a sort of cascade of words, and there weren't even any choruses, no structure. So Chaf taught us, in any case me a lot, to structure in bars: 8 bars, 16 bars, the 4-bar chorus, the melodies, all that.

Personally as a songwriter, in terms of lyrics, it’s more spacious, it’s more melodic. Then at the end you have the hidden track "Wendigo" which is the most "Koubraüss" of the songs we've ever made. The intro lasts 13 minutes on a 16-minute song! Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Pushed by a super beautiful cover. I'm really happy with the cover too. It’s a bit me who imagined it actually. We could return to it eventually. But I... and on vinyl the cover pops out obviously! Yes, yes, I've been looking at it the whole time. Yeah, that's it! Go grab it there. Yeah of course.

No, it’s really beautiful, it’s really beautiful, this cover. And the main interest, on vinyl the interest is that when you unfold the cover, well it’s the arrowhead sash in the snowbank that goes all the way around, you know? Goes all the way around to there.

And in the CD version, the CD was in the middle of the sort of fringes, the sash, as if it were a sort of electrical explosion that yielded beautiful music. And here it represents, this sash, the electrocardiogram of Quebec which is dead and which is alive when it starts oscillating again.

Hugo Lachance: Who made the cover? Is it an artist who made the cover or is it truly your own idea?

Biz: It’s my idea. It’s a graphic designer who did it according to my idea of the arrowhead sash, but afterward I don't remember... exactly, a girl... we could find her in the credits. But it was truly my idea of the arrowhead sash with the line, the electrocardiogram. It’s this sash that is on the ceiling there that we took a photo of, OK cool!

Uh, brilliant. Yeah that's it. So that one... the last one, remains my favorite, but for many, the favorite is Amour Oral.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, well for me it’s my favorite because it’s associated with a period of time, you know? It’s like created in the time where it packed a punch. It arrived like a punch to the face, it changed things too. Yeah, that's it.

Biz: And if someone tells me it’s their favorite, I won't fight to the death over it, you know? I mean, I understand why. Indeed, it’s a question of a moment in your personal life.

But we've often spoken about it with Chafiik: it’s well constructed. It’s an album that... that’s the moment where we've just signed with Audiogram and we have the means for our ambitions in the studio, you know? We have an engineer, we have an artistic director.

Because for us that was always the problem with Loco. Batlam and I were always saying: "Chafiik, we can't hear the lyrics! Turn up the lyrics, turn up the lyrics! We want people to understand the texts." He turns up the texts: "Yeah, but now we can't hear—the girls aren't dancing anymore, you know, the bass."

So we called that the squaring of the text: how to make it so that we... and we listened to Eminem: "Damn, we understand all the lyrics and it hits! Why?" And when we arrived with Amour Oral, there was an artistic director who told us: "Well you shouldn't turn up the lyrics. You just have to clear up the frequencies. Remove the... the lyrics are in the mid frequencies. So remove the mid frequencies in the music, you don't turn up the volume but you free up space for the frequencies."

And that, that was a revelation for us! Because we kept the kick... as if you want to clear a forest, you brush clear it and all that, and you have the overall view of the forest. With mixing, that's what it does: you can see the forest. So you listen to all the music and you can isolate your hearing to: "Ah, I just want to listen to the bass. I just want to listen to the lyrics." And we could do that starting with Amour Oral.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, and that takes people who... like a sound engineer, a producer who is capable of organizing the whole sonic space. Exactly. And panning and putting the lesson in 3D and re-adding your composition too. Sometimes indeed, less is more.

Less music... we tend to say, it’s counter-intuitive, but: "Ah, I'm gonna add more music, it'll be louder!" No, because when you compress everything, everything goes dim. Everything needs to be in the right place, like a game of blocks.

SEGMENT: Fannie Lussier

Hugo Lachance: Uh, but look, we're gonna dive right into creation now. So, L'Album Podcast is a podcast focused on the creation and appreciation of music... and a listener understood that perfectly following the callout I did on social media.

She sent me a collection of really relevant questions. It’s getting to the point where the listeners are doing my job for me! And that’s great, so much the better. That’s why I decided to create a new segment specially for this episode: the Fannie Lussier segment. So, shoutout to Fannie!

Uh, so her message says: "Bonjour Hugo! I have a few suggestions for questions for Loco Locass. I'll leave them here. Have a great interview and thank you for your excellent podcast!" So: what is the starting point for a song and how do they build around it?

Biz: Well, it depends on the songs. Yeah, honestly it really... it depends on the songs. So if you want... we can take them one by one to identify the starting point. But generally, it starts from a desire to say something.

In the case of Loco Locass, that desire was often motivated by a certain dissatisfaction with the world around us, particularly Quebec at the time. Uh, but not exclusively! Sometimes, you know, it’s a wish for legalization, and ultimately that ended up happening.

Then you also have a segment that is the more personal portion of "Spleen et Montréal," "Maison et Idéal," and "La Survenante," which are personal songs. So we are the—myself, Chafiik, and Batlam—the only ones writing, saying what we have to say. So we also allowed ourselves a more personal space. Over time, that has become my favorite segment on the album.

It’s my favorite segment. Yeah, well that’s where you... band. So in a band, the group itself has an identity, an entity, but in those three tunes, you can access each of our three heads.

You step into our minds and you have access to the way we work on text, the flow... they are our tunes as if we had gone solo, let's say. For me, that's why over time, from listening to the album so much, I always come back to those three tunes. They are truly my favorites.

Maybe more adult, quotes-unquotes, in the subject matter, even in the music too. Uh, so the older we get, the more we... that’s it, old-man songs maybe? So for the starting point song by song, we can do it, we're gonna do it in a little bit.

Hugo Lachance: And here, let me insert a question, and we are truly in the realm of creation... you've started talking about it, but I’d like to know: how is a rap tune created? With a rock band, it’s pretty clear: guit, bass, drums. But in your early days?

How did you manage to build the Loco sound, a tune? So the very, very beginnings, the first songs on Manifestif, were solely text. Because we didn't know Chafiik. So it was really just text that hadn't found its music.

So after that, him, right there... for Chafiik, those were beautiful years because he worked day and night. We were short on music? We had too many texts for the music! Quickly, music always comes together faster than lyrics.

We had plenty of music, you know, even starting with Amour Oral, we had tons of music and we were short on texts because writing texts took longer. But at that time, Chafiik would take texts, and sometimes we tried out different tracks, you know; let's say I remember that "Antigone," at first, the text was over the music for "Bon."

So it was a kind of reggaeton, you know? That's it. More... it was... the flow was more reggae. Then Chaf said: "Yeah, but based on the message, we're gonna put something with guitar and distortion that’s more metal," you know?

So sometimes you have to test out the music. It’s like costumes, you know? It really is custom-tailored. That’s to say, the music is the costume for the text, and it has to fit perfectly. If you buy off-the-rack, sometimes it’s too big, too small...

But Chafiik is a fashion designer. He's the Yves Saint Laurent of music! And he was capable, based on our texts, of sometimes even creating choruses. Take "Abeilles et Bestiaux," the chorus isn't even in 4/4, it shifts, you know?

When we repeat the chorus, it shifts, and it didn't bother him to have structures that were sort of in 5 with an extra bar. He was capable of making that fly in the music so that it worked. Ah, that’s cool! So at the beginning it was only texts... and afterward we would put them over music. But you mentioned a beatbox... at one point you guys had bought a beatbox?

Biz: No, not even! No, no, it’s really... we went to Chafiik's place and he was the one making the music. Then over time, we would sometimes go shopping for beats at Chafiik's place: "Alright, what have you made?"

It’s been 3-4 months since we've seen each other... "I'm going grocery shopping!" So he would lay everything out. "I have a bit of text, I think this music would go well with it." And then we'd start writing with the music on loop, the instrumental on loop, to write the tune.

So can you imagine? Before we've even performed the tune once live, we're already sick of doing it! Because we listened to the music on loop to write it, we re-recorded it tons of times. So we are... we are almost saturated before we've even done it live.

Hugo Lachance: OK, I'm really glad to know that. Uh, she continues: "I’d be curious to know their creative process for this album. How did they choose the subjects, the lines, the rhymes?"

Biz: Well, for this album, you know, that’s just it: each song has its story. But let's say if we place ourselves back in the context. We had released Manifestif, it had been very well received in the media (Record of the Week and all).

We had great reviews, as we saw with Sylvain Cormier. To this day, Éric Parazelli wrote the best review we ever got with Loco Locass for the Manifestif album. So you know, we've just done a first album.

"Je suis là je suis là" did very well as a single on Musique Plus. But we aren't on commercial radio yet, and we're a cégep band, you know? We get invited for the back-to-school events at cégeps, and we go play in cafeterias at lunchtime in cégeps, you know?

Then from time to time, we fill up a Club Soda... you know, that was our status. And we wanted to hit big with the second record, naturally. We had more means, more experience. We had signed with Audiogram, the record company that was going to produce the album.

And so we had... so at the beginning there, we were around let's say... I recall 2003, 2002, 2001... you know, those were the years we wrote Amour Oral. So we were, uh, 28 years old, you know? We were already quite old. That’s another factor too, you know?

You compare Kinkead today, let's say, he just celebrated his 18th birthday! Yeah, yeah, yeah. So naturally, he is younger. For me, when I started writing Manifestif, I already had a master's degree education behind me, you know?

So naturally that opens up the field of possibilities a bit more, you know? It prevents the follies of youth, the mistakes of youth too, you know? Well yes, but at the same time, that forms the qualities, you know... the follies of youth give an energy! That's true. But we still had energy at 28!

I don't doubt it. But so for me, it was at that time in my life. I was between 25 and 30, and I felt like I was capable of going further in the composition of our songs. And we... with Chafiik, we had found a really good modus operandi to work on that.

Hugo Lachance: It sounds like it was a beautiful period anyway, yeah, for creation.

Biz: Yeah, it was very... and you know, well: what was happening in Quebec? Well, it was George W. Bush! So that triggered "Antiaméricanisme primaire," and "W Roi" obviously.

Well, in 2003 it was the election of the Liberals with Jean Charest. Yes. And what... yes, it worked well, we can still say that to this day. But it was that people stopped me on the street and said: "You guys have to write a tune about this! This makes no sense."

I said: "Yeah, yeah, what makes no sense?" And then I went to look at it, the Liberal platform. I went to read it. I say: "Damn, he wants to tear everything down!" You know, getting rid of the Quiet Revolution model... did we really vote for that?

Uh, and then we... in the fall of 2003, I started writing the text for "Libérez-nous des libéraux." Chafiik quickly came along, arrived with the music. And then Batlam—we have to do something! He jumped in on his end.

Hugo Lachance: And the chorus, it couldn't be simpler. It’s almost a slogan, an election slogan.

Biz: Exactly! It reads like an election poster. Besides, Bernier when he was a Conservative appropriated it and had it circulating on trucks: "Libérez-nous des libéraux!" And then Loco contacted him: "You need to stop doing that right now."

Oh yeah? OK! It truly was a very simple political election slogan. But what gave the song its power was the melody. It’s... either the beat, the melody, the moment... and the moment! And the high-pitched backing vocals from the crowd too... a bit like in 2012 as well during the student strikes.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, exactly.

Biz: They are linked... we always sort of arrived at the right moment, Loco Locass. We had a knack for... I don't know if it’s a knack or a coincidence, but in any case we were there at the right moment when there was a space for us in Quebec to take the floor.

Hugo Lachance: That’s what you call timing! Let's say... uh, we'll continue with the last question: "The vast extent of their vocabulary is impressive and inspiring. The words seem selected, analyzed, dissected, and then delivered with fluidity. Is it magic, chemistry, or alchemy?"

Biz: It’s not magic. Well, I say it’s not magic... yes, sometimes it is magic! Sometimes there is something... sometimes a song falls on you like a gift.

Yeah. Well, notably one afternoon, you know... it was "Bon" and me, you know? It’s a song that obviously... when you're talking about a political subject, you always have to read the Liberal platform if you want to dismantle it. So that sometimes requires more research.

But "Bon" was just: we smoke a joint and write a tune. And originally, by the way, it was a commission we had received for a film by Clermont Péloquin called Bon. So it’s the tune for a film in which Jean Leloup had a small role.

OK. And it talks... yes, yes, the beginning of the... it’s an excerpt from the film precisely. That, we watched the film, it inspired a new kind of weed... smaller crops because they grow in the North and all. So we ran with that.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK!

Biz: It didn't take any time. Really didn't take any time. It did very well too. It did very well too, notably because of the music video. So that, I would call magic. And sometimes too, things happen that you didn't predict.

People... you write a tune and they find, they make connections that make you look smarter, like in "M'accrocher."

Hugo Lachance: Uh, that’s your song about suicide on Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec !

Biz: Yes. Guillaume Vigneault told me one day: "You know, in your chorus for 'M'accrocher,' you have all these words ending in 'un' and 'on': avancer... c'est vain, quand il n'y a pas d'horizon à mes pieds, un ravin, j'en vois même pas le fond..."

It’s a... he says: "You know, it sounds like an ambulance siren." He says: "If you thought about it... if you thought about it, you piss me off. If you didn't think about it, you piss me off!", you know? Meaning: if you thought about it, it’s a stroke of genius, and if you didn't think about it, it’s a stroke of magic, you know?

So to answer Fannie, I think, or Fanny... sometimes it’s magic, sometimes it’s genius, and sometimes alchemy. Because alchemy, I would say, is the meeting between the music and the text.

Hugo Lachance: Brilliant!

Biz: And then something... something happens and the—the music gives you a tone, a beat, a kind of vibe that makes you choose certain words rather than others.

Every artist has those moments. I was listening to Rick Beato with Flea, and he was saying that "Give It Away" happened one afternoon, a jam, and the tune... that’s a gift track, a gift from above! You learn, that’s the magical side.

But "Le But"... "Le But," that is truly pure chemistry, because it’s the tune we worked on the most: 2 years and a half we worked on it. Not 9-to-5! But still, we worked on it for 2 years and a half in terms of structure, you know? It’s the most complex structure, perhaps. So you see, that truly... it depends on each song, truly every song has its story.

SEGMENT: Presentation of the Album

Hugo Lachance: OK cool. We're gonna move on to the album presentation segment. So what we do is we go through the credits and we can discuss them because there are quite a lot of people who worked on this. It’s important to highlight them.

Uh, so: Dominique Tardif, December 19, 2024, for La Presse: "A little over 20 years ago, Loco Locass launched Amour Oral, a second album whose heavy groove left a mark on Quebec's social, political, and musical life. The three members of this now-dormant cell look back on the creation of their invitation to never stop thinking big, even if it sometimes takes a lot of courage."

"In the early 2000s, Biz and Batlam regularly took the metro together toward the Joliette station where the architect of rhythm, Chafiik, lived." I'll quote you: "For me, Amour Oral translates a sort of state of grace for the group."

This is Batlam: "We saw each other almost every day, we hung out heavily so..." Is this exactly?

Biz: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the context was truly... the conditions for creation were genuinely strong. Yeah. However, from my memory, Amour Oral was conceived more when Chaf moved into his loft on Mont-Royal.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK.

Biz: Uh, what he’s talking about there was more for Manifestif, but they overlapped.

Hugo Lachance: So the title: Amour Oral. Year: 2004. Production: it’s Chafiik. Uh, recording period?

Biz: Uh, well you know, there again, it depends. Because the other day, I took a... like a car, I unlocked it, I started the engine. On the radio, "Libérez-nous des libéraux" was playing. So in 2026. And I'm like: "Whoa!"

I listen back to it, listen to the track, and I say: "Hey! That’s not the version that’s on the disc. That’s the demo version!"

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK!

Biz: Playing on the radio. There is no federal verse and there is no mix... it’s not the same mix, it’s not the same recording. It’s truly what we did in the loft at Chaf's place! Where did that come from?

Uh, well it’s because when we did it in 2003... spring 2003 it was ready. The disc was going to come out in the fall... sorry, spring 2004 it was ready. The disc was going to come out in October 2004.

And we had redone our website, and to tell people: "Come to our site! We're gonna give you a track." OK. A track against the government. And we released it on May 1st because it was International Workers' Day.

Then we called the unions, three or four unions, and we said: "By the way, if you want to play this at your rallies, go ahead! It'll be a change from 'Ça va au bout'."

Uh, and that’s how the track took off. But that version—we hadn't... we hadn't entered Masterkut studio yet. We were going to start recording in August. So we did it at Chaf's place.

It really is the demo version. There is no federal verse and it’s not quite the same melodies in the chorus either, OK. They took the track... it’s the track we sent to radio stations, and to this day when you hear it on the radio, it’s the demo version.

Hugo Lachance: So that’s another thing I tell kids in schools: when you do something, do it right, it’s worth it. Yes, it’s true.

A rough draft that you think is just a rough draft, if it’s well done, it can become the final piece.

Hugo Lachance: Absolutely! That’s what I tell my students too: the most important portion of a project is the draft because that’s where you do your thinking. You have to do it right, yeah.

Biz: Uh, so copyright Les Disques Audiogram. Just maybe... I don't know if this is the place to talk about it, but the title Amour Oral?

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, well we had... it’s true we had a few ideas. We thought about it and it wasn't clear. But I thought it was good. The other two were all-in on it.

Biz: I was saying to myself: "It’s a good idea and it corresponds to a lot of things, and yes there is a lot of love on the record, and yes there is oral tradition." But if it takes a tangent that escapes us, like you were talking about the practice between two men earlier, I say: "It’s going to be a complete miss." You know, I had a doubt.

Uh, and ultimately it’s very funny because you go into high schools and I've said that title in front of kids 15-16 years old and it passes completely. Nobody has a malicious subtext, you know? Because 20 years later, the album remained and has almost printed its own definition of oral love.

Hugo Lachance: Well listen, I remember the first time I read it, I truly... I truly tripped out! What a great title. It’s perfect, it fits with their music. For me, it’s a title I love a lot. I was going to talk about it a bit later, actually.

Biz: And the factor that also convinced me was the cover by Philippe Allard, yeah. Talk about the cover with the character sticking his tongue out. So we've always been labeled a bit like the court jester, you know? Because there is within Loco the question of Loco, madness, and Manifestif, festive pleasure.

It keeps us... even when we talk about the Liberals, that we are furious against the government, it’s always through pleasure and with pleasure. Whether it’s live, or with wordplay, or with the rigodon at the end... there is always that notion.

And there is always... sticking the tongue out! It’s a way to contest power but with words! With words and with a bit of teenage grimacing, you know? It’s a blue flag iris petal, the floral emblem of Quebec.

So... coming out of the mouth for me! So I said to myself: "It’s this cover, in fact, that..." I said to myself: "OK, the beauty of the cover softens the bluntness of the title."

Hugo Lachance: OK. I think it’s a cabbage leaf?

Biz: No, that's it, it truly is a blue flag iris which is the floral emblem of Quebec, licking him actually. A super beautiful cover. And inside, that's it: inside it works too. Here you have the music, here you have the words, and they meet... see?

Hugo Lachance: Yeah it’s... ah yes, it’s true! OK. Oh wow! OK, I didn't... on vinyl you see it better when it’s... OK ah wow, that’s brilliant!

Biz: And here, I have some... you signed with my Chaf in this space right there. Truly it worked well, it’s a record that did very well. The lines at the bottom mean something? They already looked a bit like signatures?

Hugo Lachance: Yes, well it’s graphic scribbling by Phil Allard. Wow! Super beautiful cover, yeah. Uh, so on Audiogram. Distribution is Select. Mixed and recorded at Masterkut, that’s Chafiik's studio?

Biz: Yeah, on... no, it’s on Saint-Laurent. Saint-Laurent-Fairmount, I think.

Hugo Lachance: OK. Uh, co-artistic director Mathieu Houde. Artistic director: Denis Wolff?

Biz: Yeah, he’s the one precisely clearing up the frequencies there. For him, it wasn't like: "This is good or this isn't good," or it’s like: "What is it you want to do with this track? You want people to understand the lyrics? Well then you have to take out some hi-hat or put the hi-hat at another frequency."

Hugo Lachance: Uh, original concept, illustration by Philippe Allard. Graphic conception and production: Anne-Marie Deblois, Annie Lachapelle. Yeah, graphic designers.

Biz: Yeah. Mastering: Fernand Martel at Studio Victor. Yes, that’s in the South-West. I remember when we went, when we finished mastering, we put the CD in the car and we drove down Parc Avenue, windows open, with the volume way too loud.

And we were heading back up Parc in front of Jarry Park and it was "Résistance." The bass hits exactly how it should! And I was like: "OK! Finally my music thumps the way I want it to thump in a car!"

Hugo Lachance: After all, Eminem... yeah you realize, a mastering stage is still important.

Biz: Well the mix especially! Well you have the composition, the music, the words, the recording, the flow, the mix (separating volumes, frequencies), and then the mastering which is like a bit of varnish. It’s the varnish you put on your table, you know, which gives an impression of sonic continuity between all the songs, you know?

It gives a kind of varnish of uniformity.

Hugo Lachance: Very good image! That’s a very good image, it’s true. Uh, we continue with mixing: Gregory Smith then Roderick Shearer.

Biz: Yeah, Rod Shearer who is... well it’s Rod who started and he had a contract I think it was in Los Angeles so he left. And Rod is a grumpy Australian, OK, anglophone, who understood absolutely nothing of what we were saying on this album.

And when he left, he said: "I know a guy, he'll do the job." Well OK! Greg Smith, who is an Anglo-Montrealer from Greenfield Park, who didn't understand too much of what we were saying either but who was truly at our service and genuinely impeccable.

Greg behind the consoles... I saw him actually last week at a show my daughter was doing in a school and he was there. And he truly was impeccable behind the consoles for the album. A large portion of the sound belongs to him.

And after that, when we had finished the record and we were going on tour, we said: "Well it’s gonna take a guitarist." "Well I play guitar but I don't like doing solos, I just like playing rhythm guitar."

"Well that is exactly what we need! You know every single damn track practically frame by frame." So he climbed aboard and became our guitarist. That’s when we tripped out with him on tour and all.

Hugo Lachance: But him, had he already mixed a rap album? No. How do you do it? You arrive with reference albums and: "I’d like it to sound like this"?

Biz: Yeah, but that’s it! We had indeed... but you know, he knew music very well and if we said... we brought him Eminem now, he was capable of saying: "OK, Eminem is this. Now I transpose that for you guys, you have to do this so it sounds like that."

Hugo Lachance: OK, still. Uh, photos: Marie-Lyne Baril. Proofreading: Karine Pouliot. And vocal recording: Mr. Gregory Smith, Roderick Shearer.

Chapter 14: Questions from the Public

Hugo Lachance: We're gonna move on to the questions from the public because there are quite a lot of questions. There were some for Batlam but he isn't here. We can ask them, and maybe we've already discussed them without speaking for him?

Biz: I can... no. Because there was a good one that addresses more his TV characters. No, that I can't answer unfortunately.

Hugo Lachance: Yes. Pat Mainville: "Salut Hugo! Yes, I have a question for Loco Locass. Following your relative absence from the music scene as a group over the last few years, I was wondering if today you would still feel capable of fully defending your past songs, both in terms of their relevance and their political and cultural reach?"

Biz: That’s an excellent question. We've thought about it a lot, a whole, whole lot. And I’d tell you, that partly explains the fact that we precisely stepped away. Because Anne Hébert called that situational poetry, engaged art. You know for us, that ages fast, and sometimes badly. For example when the Liberals weren't in power—which is to say rarely while we were active—but we didn't perform "Libérez-nous des libéraux" because the job was done. And when the Canadiens didn't make the playoffs, we didn't perform "Le But" either! Because the job wasn't done in that case.

But you look at those songs and... well "Libérez-nous des libéraux" there with Carney, that, that can apply. Someone who doesn't agree with the Liberals, it can work. But you know "Résistance," it’s the political resistance of Quebec. That hasn't really aged as an idea, the idea of resistance, you know? "La Bataille des murailles," well that looks back at the Summit of the Americas in 2001. But with ICE in the US and all that, you know? It’s like we wrote them without naming things too directly. Aside from "Libérez-nous des libéraux." And the Liberals, they're always gonna be there! Just like the Canadiens are always gonna be there.

So in the end you look at that: "W Roi"... well it was Bush but it can concern Trump too. "Antiaméricanisme primaire," same thing. As a sentiment, "Groove Grave"... for me, and I say it because I didn't write the text, Batlam did, but it’s the most relevant thing I've read on 11 September, the most open, the most... I’d almost say philosophical! Practically. That text is of a... personally I think on the album it’s my favorite track and I wrote neither music nor text there. It could come out right now in terms of production quality. Even the beat with the tablas! It’s a pulsation that was nonetheless avant-garde. The flow, the subject, the tone, the chorus... for me, for me it’s one of the great songs by Loco Locass. And I say it because I'm not on it! That’s why I say it. It would still be completely relevant to reflect on September 11 and its aftermath, you know? Because its aftermath, we're still living it, you know.

Well... "Bonzaïon," that’s weed, the job is done on legalization. But with the SQDC it still works! For "La Censure pour l'échafaud"... on this sort of guilt in Quebec: "You are racists, you don't have the right to independence otherwise you're gonna become Nazis." That still works! Heck yes! Well that's it. It’s great universal themes, you know? It comes also with the theme like you were saying: "Manifestif," it works! You know it’s a recipe you guys have but which can apply to all eras too.

Exactly. And you know "Spleen et Montréal," "Maison et idéal," "La Survenante"... that’s three plunges into our respective heads. So that is timeless inevitably. It’s photographs of a moment but it remains nonetheless... "La Survenante" being the daughter of us, who is Justine, who is to be born right when he’s writing, when he learned that his girlfriend is pregnant.

Hugo Lachance: OK!

Biz: "Libérez-nous des libéraux," well as soon as they come to power you can sing it again. "Antigone" is a song against organized crime, there will always be that.

Hugo Lachance: Uh-huh.

Biz: And "Engouement," well it’s a track about the pleasure of speech and energy and which spins and all that. So in the end, you know what’s in there could be, I think, still sung. But it’s because at one point too, in the 2010s, we felt like we were redoing Loco and we didn't want to... after Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec ! to say to ourselves: "Ah well now it’s the CAQ, write a song against the CAQ!". No. That’s it. It becomes recipes and we were playing at being Loco Locass. And that, it’s like being less authentic too. Yes, well inevitably! And you do it perhaps for the wrong reasons, to pay for your cottage... so that didn't interest us. And we had performed those songs a lot, to the point of making ourselves sick of them too. So that partly explains the fact that we decided to stop. You know, we didn't make one album too many! I think we didn't even make one song too many, unlike some bands... Load, Reload, and Re-Reload, you cut some out somewhere!

Hugo Lachance: What happened, the end of Loco if you want, was it a joint decision or was it just time that frayed it?

Biz: It’s a joint decision. And also we had as a band, you know... over 25 years, there is a lot of dust accumulated under the rug.

Hugo Lachance: Oh well yes! That’s clear.

Biz: And we often... the stage sanctifies, you know? That’s to say: you do a good show, you have fun, the three of us trip out and we high-five, we go drink afterward... it’s fun.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah.

Biz: There are... so we swept the dust under the rug but we never truly vacuumed in the corners. OK? So the dust, it accumulates over time. And sometimes there are things that... keeping a couple together over 25 years is already a lot. Three massive ego trips over 25 years is a lot too. So grievances accumulated on both sides, and a fatigue I’d say of being together to make something together. Because we were literally sometimes together 24/7 on tour. The tour for Amour Oral, we did it over 2 years and a half, right there! I saw those two guys, I saw them more than anyone else around me then!

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, you can understand.

Biz: So there was a fatigue with being together the three of us I think, and a need for distance. To do other things. Chaf made music, Sno went to act... myself I wrote novels. So... and the idea that in... personally I like just as much meeting people, kids who tell us: "Ah! I’d love to see a show! I've never seen you guys live! Why don't you do more shows? I saw the one in 2012, Maple Spring, it was crazy!" Personally I really like the idea of being engraved, because if we started again, we would never live up to a memory. A memory is magnified inevitably, you know? We had offers for the 20th anniversary to do a Bell Centre to perform Amour Oral in its entirety, you know?

Hugo Lachance: Yeah. Oh yeah? OK!

Biz: Personally, I wouldn't have said no, I think, to that idea. A shorter show obviously that we would have rehearsed tremendously. But you know, rap, rap belongs to youth. The rest of us there, we are all in our fifties... been a long time since we've ridden a bicycle! Getting back on the bicycle would be a lot of work, you know? It goes fast! There’s a lot of energy. It would be different. Would it be as good? I don't know. The fans also naturally stir up less energy... no that’s... everything is in the way it’s done according to me, right. That’s for sure! You shouldn't... a bit like when you see recent videos of Cypress Hill, you know?

Hugo Lachance: Yeah.

Biz: Sen Dog, he is completely shaved and he has a four-foot-long wig whereas before it was his real hair! OK, OK. On the other hand, Cypress Hill could have given a lesson to any band of young punk rappers, it was so... but an album or an EP by Loco, would it be possible just in the studio, let's say? Precisely with time and the fact of aging? Not right now. Not right now. OK. Personally I would never say never unless... as long as the three of us are alive. But right now it’s... it’s out of the question. OK. And it seems like the more we've learned to do without Loco Locass in our lives, the less we need it. It’s more the fans who talk to us about it.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? Because that’s just it, as you say, memories are magnified. And Loco, it belongs to an intense period for us too. It’s magnified in our memories as young guys starting out in life.

Biz: I’d be curious to hear what could come out of Loco Locass now. Now the pulse has changed in rap, you know? So we have two choices: either we are the old gentlemen who redo the old-gentlemen recipes of Loco Locass, or we try to rap over new beats and we are old gentlemen trying to be young and it doesn't work! So adult rap... I don't know. Snoop Dogg is capable of aging well making rap. Eminem too. It’s possible maybe, but at one point there is a physical limit too there. Personally I don't think I'm capable of rapping as fast as... that’s clear.

Hugo Lachance: OK. We continue with the questions from the public. There is Pierre-Olivier Brassard: "Wow man! Do they still smoke Bonzaïon?"

Biz: No. The truth is that Chafiik smoked for the three of us!

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah?

Biz: Him, he smoked heavily, it helped him. Well, what he once explained to me, he says: "When you're doing a mix on a track or even when you're composing a song and you hear just every single bass drum hit one by one practically, it’s alienating. At some point you no longer have perspective on the track, OK? And to gain perspective you have to let time pass. And for me, when I smoke a joint, it’s as if I had spent 10 days without listening to the track: it resets the counter to zero." That's it. So sometimes during the Amour Oral tour there were people who gave us hits of a joint and we took them. But then if we did the track at the beginning of the show, we were baked for the remainder of the gig! It’s not ideal then. It’s not cool for the crowd either. Well it’s a bit weird sometimes. So the articulation isn't the same... my mouth and... the weed isn't the same, it’s way too strong! So sometimes... I have a memory at one point in Trois-Rivières of having smoked that during the second track, of having found the show a bit weird. But we had done it so much we could have performed the tracks backward! We knew them so well, yeah. It became mechanical, yeah that's it.

Hugo Lachance: OK. Alright well thanks Pierre-Olivier for your question. Alexandre Philippe, from the podcast Du bruit à mes oreilles, asks Biz what he thinks of the new wave of sovereignist rap like Kinkead?

Biz: Well Kinkead, I have a lot of respect. A lot of envy even to see him at 18 where we were when we were starting out, you know? And to see the fervor in his shows... I'm going to see him live soon in Montreal. To see Quebec flags in the crowd, to see that people sing, the kids sing... immense respect to Kinkead and to the kids making music in a post-pandemic context that is more difficult. I don't even know how we would make a living from our music ourselves if we were starting out now.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah. The reality has changed, that’s clear.

Biz: It’s difficult for the younger ones. and there is my boy who makes rap beats who introduces me to artists too and I try not to get too far removed from that scene even if I am removed, at least to try to understand, to follow the puck.

Hugo Lachance: The movement, exact!

Biz: But you know, I mean, it would be so silly and pretentious to say: "After me the deluge!" and "It was so much better in the good old days." But what interests me above all is the quality of the writing. So you see, I am more sensitive to a guy like Manu Militari in the quality of the pen, you know? It’s sure that if you talk about your reality as a kid who wants to make cash and wants to pick up girls, that doesn't connect with me. But I'm capable of appreciating a good flow and a good beat too, yeah that’s clear.

Hugo Lachance: OK. Last question before moving on to listening to the album. Ghyslain G. Gaudet: "Did the collaboration with Malajube happen smoothly? And did you anticipate the reception of the album Trompe-l'œil?" On the collaboration with Malajube you guys did that?

Biz: Yeah, it’s on Trompe-l'œil, it’s "La Russe." Listen, it happened because we have always admired Malajube since the beginning. And when Julien, I think, came to see us, contacted us: "We're making the album, would you like to do something on the album?". And he sends us the beat for "La Russe" which was super stimulating! And I was like: "Wow! It’s super inspiring."

What happened with that track is that in the concept of Trompe-l'œil for Julien, it was that each song had a theme around a disease.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK!

Biz: Each track, related to a disease. And I listened to the beat and I wanted... for the longest time, there is a disease that completely fascinates me: it’s Tourette syndrome. Because it’s a disease that is neurological where people have physical tics and the brain goes off track a little bit, but which has a linguistic component because you say profanities while you have your tics. And that has always fascinated me because if someone who has this disease moves to another country and learns another language, are they gonna start swearing in another language? There are plenty of things that fascinate me in that. So I said: "OK, we're gonna make a track about Tourette syndrome." So the idea of the track is that we participate in a radio show called "L'évangile de la Tourette." It’s Batlam who is the radio host receiving Loco Locass, asking questions and Loco Locass answers. It’s been a long time and...

But what’s funny with that is that the version we proposed to Malajube, it was extremely vulgar! Naturally, because it’s Tourette syndrome. And Malajube are everything except vulgar. And Julien, I remember with the guys, they bristled a bit at... it was good there, it was that! And then ultimately they decided to keep the parts that were less vulgar, which describe Tourette syndrome. Now I'm telling you, it’s my disease. So it was expunged of its vulgarity. There exists... I don't know where somewhere a version called "La grosse Russe," which itself is the entirety with everything it contains of vulgarity.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK! I'm curious to hear that.

Biz: Yeah, it was on Bandcamp at one point and now I think it’s not even there, OK, ah wow! Uh, but how it happened was... mutual admiration I think. We went to perform it a few times live with them. It’s far away all that nonetheless, yeah it’s very far away. And that album, Trompe-l'œil, a great Quebec album of the years... yes that’s clear, it’s clear. I’d love to do an episode with them actually, the message is out there!

Hugo Lachance: Uh yes, there was a final one, from Alexandre Nadeau: "Hey! Ask them if there is a reissue planned on vinyl?"

Biz: Well, answered your question! There are some left, they aren't on sale yet. We just received them so yes, they will be on sale, OK. End of March if I remember correctly, in all good record stores in Quebec.

Hugo Lachance: Wow! Super! I have that as a world premiere?

Biz: Oh yes! On L'Album Podcast. And well it’s perfect. It’s gonna come out in the month of March so Amour Oral and Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec !. Brilliant! By popular demand because we were truly asked for it a lot. We had made a few on a single vinyl with a black cover which included 8 tracks only. But now this is the entirety of the album and with perhaps what is most important: all the lyrics for all the tracks that are there. And they are double vinyls because...

Hugo Lachance: And the vinyls are black or are they...?

Biz: Uh, the vinyls are... I'm gonna show you. Ah it’s beautiful! Or it’s the character from the cover? Yeah. And here... with an insert. Wow! And this cover is beautiful! It’s quite something! Does the job. Particularly on vinyl. This is the... OK cool. CD, yeah, perfect. Arrowhead-sash baseline! It’s really beautiful, yeah personally I really like black vinyl. There are some not bad colored or transparent ones but this does the job right there, yeah!

Chapter 15: SEGMENT: One Song After Another

Hugo Lachance: OK. And we're gonna move on to the segment "One Song After Another." We're gonna move on to the podcast itself! The tracks of the podcast that we do, it’s that we listen to an excerpt of the track and then we discuss it. We go with "Résistance."

[Excerpt of Résistance: The world, I don't want to know where they come from, to know where they're going...]

So "Résistance." Well that, what an intro, eh?

Biz: Yeah that... it opens with Falardeau, whom we had invited to a show at the Métropolis during the Francos, and he had done an address to the nation. And he talks about colonialism essentially, as he knew how to do so well. And there is a thing too with Loco, it’s that each first song begins with the last song of the previous album.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK! OK.

Biz: So Manifestif ends with the crowd clapping hands, and then it restarts with that. We hadn't made that connection! It’s all these little easter eggs we put in for those who know. And yes well that's it: it begins with Falardeau, it couldn't... who endorsed us from the beginning and we miss him so much right now. And it went without saying. The match was perfect, oh yeah! His speech is still so relevant... haven't changed a comma in there! So... and what I was telling you earlier about... in the mix that we hear, the bass that slaps, the lyrics, the classical sampling... for me it’s an album that is well produced.

Hugo Lachance: Ah yes it’s crazy! Because and I really love how it begins because right away you set the stage for the rest of the album: there is the speech, the beat arrives and you begin. There is the bass, there is the whole sound too which is truly pro. What you guys were looking for? A production that is genuinely professional, you know? That's it. We went from garage punk to... yeah! Metallica, Black Album, yeah exact! OK, very cool. And the intro text is super good too. And no, personally it’s a track I love a lot, it’s one of my favorites on the album. You have anything to add on that?

Biz: Personally, my verse, I remember that I listened 24/7 to The Eminem Show, OK? And that I hear in the flow that I have on this verse right there Eminem, "Without Me" let's say, or "Business"... for me it corresponds with a kind of symbiosis with Eminem to say to yourself: OK he is so strong in his flow, in his versatility, that I'm gonna try to have fun with that.

Chapter 16: One Song After Another (Continued)

Biz: I remember it was that specific era. It was the time of "Club de foot" in 2003. So we were surrounded by heavy, heavy rap and that made us want to push things further.

Hugo Lachance: OK. And with Loco Locass, did you get any feedback or comments from, say, American or French artists, or any international recognition?

Biz: From Americans, zero. From the French, nothing either. I don't think... we have a few fans in France, but not among the artists themselves. For instance, MC Solaar has never said, "Ah! I listened to Loco Locass, it was good." Maybe that's still to come?

Hugo Lachance: Oh, perhaps! So, we continue with "La Bataille des murailles."

[Excerpt from La Bataille des murailles]

Hugo Lachance: So, "La Bataille des murailles." On backing vocals: there's André Marchand, Jean-Claude Mirandette, Michel Bordeleau, plus Michel Faubert and Normand Miron, along with Les Charbonniers de l'Enfer!

Biz: Yeah, whom we just heard. Well, this song... I'm the one who wrote the lyrics. We went to Quebec City in the spring of 2001, which was a huge anti-globalization protest during a political meeting between all the heads of state of the Americas to establish a free-trade agreement. But that agreement was secret, and they didn't want to reveal it. So we said, "Well, that doesn't fly!". Tons of people... talk about my political awakening! Listen, there was literally a barricade near the Grand Théâtre in Quebec City. They were locked inside the hotels. There were provincial and federal police officers, and incredible citizen solidarity! We got gassed, we soaked handkerchiefs in vinegar, all of that.

So it was all of that... we were rapping, we had even started a music video with "Langage-toi" at the barricades. That left a huge impression on me, and I wanted to account for it, but I didn't want to explicitly talk about Quebec City 2001 and all that. Because that ages fast and locks the song into a box. So I said to myself, "Ah! But throughout history, economic empires have always wanted to expand, integrate countries, do free trade and all that." Then I thought, "I could do a medieval theme." At that time I was wasting a lot of time on the game Heroes of Might and Magic II, OK? The one with dragons, a turn-based strategy game with knights. And I was wondering why I wasn't working on the album instead of playing that game? But in the end, when I started writing "La Bataille," I had this whole medieval vocabulary of portcullises, knights, and all of that.

And the track just flowed because of that for the lyrics. And after that, I went to see Chaf and I said, "Make me some medieval rap!", which is a bit of an oxymoron.

Hugo Lachance: Aside from "La tribu de Dana," it doesn't really exist... that's true.

Biz: So I had this idea of using a hurdy-gurdy—a medieval instrument that’s like a violin but with a circular bow, which basically creates a loop effect—making a direct connection to sampling, exactly! And what he did wasn't using an actual hurdy-gurdy; instead, he sampled an African violin from an African track, looped it, and bent it. He basically pulled a classic Chafiik! He put in the colonels, he added the spices to the recipe! And that’s what made it. I heard that and said: "It’s perfect! That’s exactly what we need." Then at some point, Bat and I went to see a show by Les Charbonniers de l'Enfer while we were writing. And it blew our minds! Literally five guys, five dudes a cappella singing folk music with these melodies and a sort of wall of sonic beauty, made of nothing but voices!

Hugo Lachance: Yes.

Biz: And we made three very important decisions that night. He asked me to be the godfather of his daughter. I said yes! And incidentally, Justine was born on my birthday... which means I can never forget her birthday. Next, we decided to invite them onto "Bataille des murailles," saying: "Ah! It’s medieval, it works perfectly with their sound." And we decided to put lilting—the turlute—into "Libérez-nous des libéraux." That show was truly major.

Hugo Lachance: Wow! OK.

Biz: So we invited Les Charbonniers, and Chaf worked with them. When you listen to this track in headphones, you get all the soundscape work from Les Charbonniers with the drones, the guys' voices... which culminates in a crescendo that drops back down at the end, you know? It’s a track with a very solid structure. The chorus isn't bad... the "guilty" voice is a sample from the Box case. Ah yes, OK! When he says "guilty by reason of insanity." So a little easter egg paying tribute to Jean-Claude Box. At the beginning, we talk about Fidel Castro, who hadn't been invited to the Summit of the Americas. So he isolates himself... that was the concept. It also kinda hints at the Night of the Long Knives? It can make you think of a lot of things! Because live on stage, when we did it and everyone had their fist up during the chorus... and I remember, you know, when I told you experience was kicking in: I could hear the crowd saying "comrades, all to the barricades." I saw the people with their fists up... I visualized it. And when we performed it, I have memorable moments of 3,000 people with their fists in the air. You say to yourself: "We are..." And right there, I was glad I hadn't explicitly talked about the Quebec City Summit, because a lot of people who didn't go wouldn't have been able to connect. But this way, just about any social struggle could connect with the barricades and the line "no way we're being led to the slaughterhouse without being able to know what power is hiding from us in the dark."

Hugo Lachance: Exactly! That applies to everything. Precisely! So you took a track that wasn't tied to one specific event, making it timeless. Perfect! Plus the atmosphere is great, and for me... live, it acts like a starter! You get things going.

Biz: We often played it early on as the 2nd or 3rd track, precisely to set the table. The build-up starts almost a cappella with the hurdy-gurdy, it rises, it rises, it culminates all the way to the battle, and then it goes back down with a sort of reflection.

Hugo Lachance: The sequencing of the songs is also super well placed.

Biz: Exactly! It’s the second one, right after "Résistance."

Hugo Lachance: OK. And I also love the sound. There is a beautiful originality to the sound. I imagine in rap tracks, there aren't many songs like this one?

Biz: No, no. Especially with Les Charbonniers coming in to grit it up with a texture of old gentlemen that we aren't used to hearing in rap.

Hugo Lachance: Plus it fits... it’s our roots! Exactly! And you were never afraid to integrate that into your music either?

Biz: No, no, for us identity—our entire identity and the quotes we use in reference to the artists who preceded us—is part of our legacy, actually. It’s about introducing people to a ton of different things.

Hugo Lachance: That’s how you... you found your identity as well... Like I told you: we go see another artist's show and we go, "Hey! Let's put a turlute into 'Libérez-nous des libéraux'!" That's major, you know? Like you say about artists—it's often repeated—but there is no better audience than other artists, in the sense that it feeds you so much! Going to a museum, going to see a movie, going to see a show... because you say: "I hadn't thought of that!" I'd go see a jazz show or an African djembe performance... "I think we could do something with that ourselves."

Chapter 17: W Roi & Antiaméricanisme primaire

Hugo Lachance: OK, cool! Let's continue with "W Roi." A little bit of... should I do it with the "you think them" parts?

Biz: Yeah.

[Excerpt from W Roi]

Hugo Lachance: Excellent, that! It’s a short track, almost like a little intro. And Batlam wrote the text following the collapse of the towers and the fact that the images were rolling on loop.

Hugo Lachance: But it says it's you?

Biz: Ah no, yes, no, it’s Batlam, Batlam. OK. Who put "lyrics by Biz"? No, I don't have a single line in that one. And it made a reference for him to Ubu Roi, the play... you know, that’s it, you know? Batlam has a background in theater, as an actor, so he’s completely soaked in great classical plays. So naturally that shows in his writing in there. It’s obvious. The "W" being W. Bush, the American president, making a reference to Ubu Roi.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah! And it’s a short piece with a speed-up in the music. And from memory, we recorded it at Masterkut, the three of us at the same time, so we did...

Biz: But was there a live drummer? No, no, the music uses real drums of course, but the music was playing in our headphones and the three of us were each in three separate booths. We had practiced a lot to punch the words, to pass things back and forth...

Hugo Lachance: I got the impression this one was more live with a real drummer, because...?

Biz: No, OK, because I think the drums were played by Jean-Sébastien Nicol, our drummer. So it’s kind of the intro to the next one: "Antiaméricanisme primaire."

Hugo Lachance: Let's move on to "Antiaméricanisme primaire." Can we play the vinyl?

[Excerpt from Antiaméricanisme primaire]

Biz: So, "Antiaméricanisme primaire." That’s a Chafiik track all the way—text and music by Chafiik. And at the root of that—because we forget sometimes—Chafiik wrote about 10% of Loco Locass's lyrics, so... at first, he didn't plan on writing rap. But rubbing shoulders with us, he saw how we did it and it made him want to write. I remember at the beginning, he presented his verse to us for "Malaise malaisant"... and he was very insecure or embarrassed or shy about it because he said: "I have to match the level of you guys."

And he shows it to us: it packs a punch, man! Go hard, you know! It’s like: we're gonna give you as much room as you need. And since he was very busy with the music, it wasn't like the Beastie Boys, but he had his space for reflection and expression. When the towers fell and everything that happened after the invasion of Iraq, he was angry. He was truly angry. And he says: "I see that we're often accused of: 'Ah, you're a primitive anti-American!' Me? Yes, I am! Right here, yes, OK!" And Chafiik's mother is Lebanese. So he has a connection to Lebanon, the Arab world. Loco's groove is Arab, actually. Music-wise, he uses a lot of sampling from the darbouka, chants, sounds. That’s part of him, of his culture; he incorporated it into Loco's sonic identity.

Hugo Lachance: And there's a link to be made with traditional music too, right? Like in Quebec, in the sense that it’s often instruments where you hold a note and there's a loop too.

Biz: Yeah, well that's it! So it blended well. You could say that. And on that track, well that's just it: he had a lot on his chest, he had a lot to say. And he made this situational song. But you could release that right now!

Hugo Lachance: Heck yes, yeah!

Biz: With what’s going on... I mean: arresting children without a warrant! That makes absolutely no sense. Going further? No, that’s it. Even the Republicans are telling Donald: "Calm down, this is going too far." For sure! And you know, you have Green Day at the Super Bowl who were very clever, telling people instead of saying "you're assholes," they said: "Your jobs, quit your shitty jobs and join us!" That’s very clever. I watched the halftime show, a bunch of clichés. Another podcast, maybe?

Chapter 18: Groove Grave

Hugo Lachance: OK. We continue with the track "Groove Grave."

[Excerpt from Groove Grave]

Hugo Lachance: Well, "Groove Grave." Look, I think it’s perhaps the best music Chafiik has ever made. With the tablas! For me, it’s a stroke of genius in there! The Indian tablas.

Biz: You're telling us there's very little in it in the end? Very few elements, but... everything is there. Everything is perfect. The pulse too, a very particular 4/4. Boom-bap. The flow—Batlam is perfectly integrated into it. At the beginning, we hear sounds following the collapse of the towers, the panic of the people in New York.

Hugo Lachance: Ah yes, OK!

Biz: So it’s truly a sequence: "W Roi"—"Antiaméricanisme" and "Groove Grave." Because it marked us so deeply, since it was 2001. We were in the middle of writing the record. So it changed the world. It literally changed the world, truly. And for me, the beat on this is really good, and the words too! The words... look, I isolated this: "La bîme brame sous nos pieds qui triment tram. Ah ouais ? Dann desin dann comme didane... quand je rime je rame sur la bîme qui brame c'est comme un bon baume, un qui me calme vraiment tout." Those were the golden years of Zinedine Zidane, who had just won the Cup with Les Bleus, and man, people talked to us about that so much! Zinedine Zidane, it’s like... and the people who try to... I'm capable of doing B-sides. For me, it’s a source of pride when I succeed. Well, that’s it! Exactly. It’s almost a diction exercise. Yes! But you know, there is a quality to that text, a quality of reflection. We talk about Manic-5, we talk about Nietzsche... he took time to reflect on what had happened and he brought something out of it... for me, a high quality of reflection. And that’s rare in politically engaged music. Usually it’s done in the heat of the moment; it has its qualities, but it ages badly.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, it’s good to have some perspective.

Biz: Yeah, sometimes. "Tu sais l'hégémonie voue aux gémonies les régimes honnis or au cœur même de l'homogène gîte l'ennemi Ben Laden ou Timothy McVeigh pareil au même en hégémonie. Bounce le gros ! Pense le gros, ça prend du courage." Still quite something, that. Yeah, that's it. It’s a super good text. Yeah, it’s a very good text. Personally, I find it’s perhaps one of the best pieces of music by Loco and perhaps one of the best texts.

Hugo Lachance: Ah, I agree with that too. Anything else to add?

Biz: No.

Chapter 19: Bon & Bonzaïon

Hugo Lachance: OK. We go with "Bon." Maybe the music video?

Biz: It’s one of my favorite videos because we basically burn purses. I don't remember the video at all! It’s a very good video and it has aged very well. We burn Louis Vuitton purses and other luxury brands. And we... the text, you see the text scrolling in animation and you see... we aren't even in it! It’s just purses burning. Well, one of my favorite videos and I think to this day, it has aged very well too.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? OK. I'll put the link in the description, but I don't remember that. I'll go check it out. Cool. Now we pass to: "Bon ! Bordel de merde ! Mais tu n'en as pas besoin de mes 50 balles ? Quoi ? 100 000 Claude ! C'est du bonzaïon !"

[Excerpt from Bon]

Biz: So, "Bon." The intro, as you can hear, is part of the movie Bon. It’s the truck door opening, and he sees the plants and says: "This weed is worth a fortune." Well, that’s the gift track I was talking about earlier. Originally, the beat hosted the text for "Antigone." Then at some point we changed "Antigone," so the beat remained available. So when we were asked to make the track, I said to myself: "Well, if you're talking about weed, reggae-raggamuffin, it can work." So I really had fun with that one. I have a more reggae-raga voice. I had fun with the melodies too, because I'm not a very great melodist. Out of the three of us, I'm clearly the one who always had the hardest time with notes and everything. Then the "mails", the "mails"... those are very simple little melodies, but I'm the one who found them. So I was pretty happy with that.

"It’s cloned weed!" And then I'd hear the crowd shouting "Hey! Hey! Hey!" during the shows. Indeed, this album is the album where, when I was writing stuff, I took the audience into account. Because on Manifestif, the audience didn't exist! So I didn't know what it was like to do shows; I had never done any. Whereas here, I knew what it was like to do shows. I say to myself: "Live on stage, this right here! Oh yeah! The crowd is gonna do this, we're gonna ask the crowd to do that... can you do it from here?" Exactly! So you're better at... adding little melodies. The text came together in an afternoon. My—Batlam's verse also came pretty quickly. We laughed while doing it. And the end is just that: in this song, we call for the legalization of cannabis in Quebec, which ultimately took place several years later under Justin Trudeau. And the end of the song is a sort of intro transition for "La Censure pour l'échafaud." That’s why, among other reasons, this album is Chafiik's favorite: the songs are truly linked, it’s like a story.

Hugo Lachance: Each song is a chapter and they are all fully linked. Exactly! There's a sort of crossfade, making this album very pleasant to listen to.

Biz: That's it! On vinyl, it flows nicely, you know? You listen and you flip it to change sides. And so we go from three guys smoking joints, who are stoned, to paranoia regarding Quebec identity for "La Censure pour l'échafaud." So... it’s a sort of transition. And that part, the transition in question, took us so much time to do at Masterkut studio! Because we weren't stoned at all! And we couldn't find the right tempo and it wasn't working. And Greg, I remember, the sound engineer, spent 3-4 hours behind the consoles repeating: "That’s not it!", and "That’s not right!" Then at some point...

Then I remember, at one point they made believe I was smoking a joint and Bat- "Come on! Give it here! Take a hit!" And then I say: "No, no! I don't feel like it, it makes me paranoid." Then he insists and I... it’s as if I get a bit mad and trip over my words a little: "No! Don't go getting paranoid!" And right then, they burst out laughing like stoned people laughing at silly things. And right there, we had found the tone!

Hugo Lachance: That’s great! Just messing around!

Biz: But it brought us to paranoia, you know? Because that’s what I was saying: weed has become too strong! For me, more... it makes me paranoid. Same thing. But we also get paranoid when it comes to being called racists! It’s super good. There are references also to A Clockwork Orange, "Exactly," "Wog"? Yeah... "Gollywog," yeah all of that. Yeah, it’s a pretty... "J'entends la lumière, je vois les sons." Those are the "Correspondences" by Baudelaire too, when he himself in Les Paradis artificiels trips out on tapestries. So that’s it! It’s the whole beauty of the intoxication of drugs: it modifies the perception of the senses. That’s why we abandon ourselves to it.

Chapter 20: La Censure pour l'échafaud

Biz: So that leads us to "La Censure pour l'échafaud." Here we go!

[Excerpt from La Censure pour l'échafaud]

Biz: So, "La Censure pour l'échafaud." Just to mention that it features the flugelhorn by Gontran Ducasse; double bass, Eric West-Millette; the French horn by D'Iberville Plante; and the violin by Guido Del Fabbro, yeah.

Hugo Lachance: It’s a song... Guido is just, he makes the connection to Vulgaires Machins. He’s the one who made the connection with the Vienna orchestra they used for the recording of their last album. Guido Del Fabbro... well, he’s a friend of Chafiik's who is very talented, whom he used in several songs. He'd come in and do parts. And you know, this song is precisely organic and has a classical orchestral baseline with very deep violins. It’s because the subject of this song is very grave, trying to... it’s a song that literally refutes the accusations of racism that are constantly thrown at Quebecers under the pretext that they want to decolonize themselves.

Biz: Yeah. So it’s a very slippery subject. I think it was handled quite skillfully in the message there. I love the chorus a lot too, which opens up, it’s almost operatic. Which I always had such a hard time singing live! Sometimes Chafiik would tell me: "OK! Stop that, it’s not working anymore." Sometimes I did it, sometimes I pulled back my mic. But once again: two verses by Batlam, a chorus by Batlam, really well put together.

And my verse there too, in my flow you can really hear Eminem. Those were my The Eminem Show years. A lot of influence in the flow! And I talk, for example, about my grandfather whose name was Jean-Rock. Jean-Rock, his crew of dam- that could be sacrificed to denazify Europe, you know, it’s like: "Well, you're calling us racists and Nazis! But look, we went to the plate in Normandy! Calm down, Doritos," as my daughter would say. So it was about that there. Like: this Canada that decapitated the Métis, exterminated the indigenous peoples, conquered the francophones... keep a lid on it before calling others racists! Alright? That’s kind of the message of the tune. And Batlam makes reference to the Michaud affair too, which was very serious at the time.

Hugo Lachance: OK! I didn't know that story.

Biz: Uh, no, we continue with "Spleen et Montréal." Maybe a quick note regarding "La Censure pour l'échafaud": the video! An animated video that was done by a guy from CatBurglaz, which was a rap group at the time that we hung out with. An animated video, super funny with plenty of very clever, very entertaining references too. One of my good videos that ages very well. I don't remember the—any videos at all on YouTube! OK. I'm definitely gonna go listen to that. So that’s that. After that, we're far from Nazis and "La Censure pour l'échafaud" and... and that's it! "La Censure pour l'échafaud" also references Ascenseur pour l'échafaud, the movie for which Miles Davis did the music, improvised the music. Exactly! So it’s a little nod too, when I said that arts can interpenetrate, inter-influence.

Chapter 21: Spleen et Montréal

Hugo Lachance: True. So after, well, "Spleen et Montréal."

[Excerpt from Spleen et Montréal]

Biz: It makes reference to a poem by Baudelaire called "Spleen et Idéal." Spleen is a bit of a depressive state. And this is the little kid from Quebec City who moves to Montreal with big ideals, including making rap. And in the end, it doesn't go exactly how he wants. It went by fast. And there are moments, you know, when we were writing Manifestif and even Amour Oral, cash wasn't coming in all that much. We weren't doing shows anymore. "And who am I here?" You know, it’s... "Do I continue with this? Do I do something else?" I think all musicians, all artists have had this reflection at one point or another in their career. And for me, it was truly that there! And plenty of people who moved to Montreal said: "I felt exactly like that." The sort of desire to do big things and in the end, in my daily life, I stay on the couch and don't do much. So depressive feelings from which I would make a first novel in 2010, which I used to make a song out of.

So this is my text. It’s truly my personal space. Music by Chafiik too, he was the one playing piano.

Hugo Lachance: Where did he find piano?

Biz: Yeah, he did it. OK, still. OK. Female vocals for the chorus, which is very ethereal. A short song that does the job, I’d say there.

Hugo Lachance: Well, I like it a lot. I like it a lot! Like I was telling you earlier, it’s like my favorite segment over time now. Because as you were saying: we age! So we make more connections, I imagine, with less desire for shouting too, maybe. It’s a song that is more grounded. And on top of that, there is a bad video, I’d say! Perhaps Loco's worst video! It was a shame for all kinds of reasons, we didn't get what we wanted. And it doesn't matter! Nobody bats 1,000 in baseball. That one ended up in the catcher's glove. But a video exists nonetheless. Put the videos in the description.

Chapter 22: Maison et idéal

Hugo Lachance: Uh, but we pursue with my favorite track on the album:

[Excerpt from Maison et idéal]

Biz: So, "Maison et idéal." Obviously, we don't listen to the whole thing, but the track takes off a bit at the tail end. At the end with Karim, from the group Syncop, who is an Algerian friend who hung around with us and came to do shows with us. And in there, well, it’s a song with lyrics and music by Chafiik. It’s truly his inner self as a guy composing music. "Maison et idéal" references "Spleen et Montréal," so Baudelaire's "Spleen et Idéal." A little link between the two titles. And it’s truly that! Chafiik is like: "I am a homebody, I can't deny it!" He’s inside and he makes beats, that’s his job! So while the rest of us were drinking and doing... we were tripping out with everyone, well, he’s making his beats and that’s his job, you know? So it’s not always easy, but it’s exhilarating, it allows him to travel indeed. So that’s his inner world.

And we have a song that is so stripped down! You just have the... and the boom, the big 808 and the drums, you know. It’s minimalist. That’s where Chafiik's genius truly exploded! Because the better you are at your job, the less you do. At the beginning, your workflow improves? Well, and you know, less is more! And on that, and at the end with the soaring of... and live we sang Karim's lyrics in Arabic! So...

Hugo Lachance: Ah!

Biz: So we didn't quite have the accent obviously, but it gave something. A great moment of openness in the show! Sometimes Karim came to do it with us, and you know, that precisely incorporated the idea that our project for Quebec wasn't closed off on the fleur-de-lys... that the Arab groove enters our Quebec. And Chaf always said: music in a project like Loco Locass corresponds a bit to the unconscious of the group. And when your music draws from all the music of the world, including and especially Arab music, well, it says that your project is open without you even needing to say: "We are open, we are inclusive!" It goes without saying.

Hugo Lachance: Ah yeah! Absolutely. And it also fits with the beginning of the album, you know? You want to know where the world is heading, you know? It means even if Chafiik talks to us about a guy making music in his house (zero political level), the fact that he does it with an Arab groove and an Arab guest brings an openness.

Biz: Ah, it’s super! I love this song a lot—the beat, everything, the lyrics too.

Chapter 23: La Survenante

Hugo Lachance: Uh, we continue our marathon with "La Survenante."

[Excerpt from La Survenante]

Hugo Lachance: It’s like the weird track on the album!

Biz: But the more perspective I have, the more I listen to it, the more interesting I find it because it offers a flow that is truly unique. Yes! And we're almost in R&B mode on it with the finger snapping, you know? The chorus too, which could be sung almost by a gospel choir. Lyrics by Batlam, music by Chafiik. And the work... if Chafiik spoke about his work as a guy making music in "Maison et idéal," here it’s the work of the guy who writes, who has to labor over his page. And writing is making chaos pass through the eye of a needle! It’s so much that, there!

Batlam has a way with poetic phrasing! You know, it’s poetic... on Manifestif, La Survenante, and Groove Grave, in my opinion, these are rap texts but they could be in a book next to Gaston Miron, it wouldn't be embarrassing. Absolutely! For me, it’s a great mastery of text indeed. A flow that is very calm... we were quite hyper, eh, the court jesters! And here it’s like: he's gonna become a father! So calm down, uncle! And he welcomes at the end "La Survenante" who is his daughter at the end. So he passes from the guy who writes to the guy who is gonna welcome his daughter and he dedicates this text to her. Which references obviously Le Survenant by Germaine Guèvremont. It’s this trio: "Spleen," "Maison," and "La Survenante." It’s truly a little pass in the record where we calm down and we access the inside of the heads of the three guys there.

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, I find it makes for a truly trippy moment on the album.

Chapter 24: Antigone

Hugo Lachance: We continue with "Antigone."

[Excerpt from Antigone]

Hugo Lachance: So, "Antigone." I'm thinking, I found an article by Jacques Bouchard, February 4, 2005. "Loco Locass attacks the inertia of citizens in the face of core problems in our society. Everything is fine as long as poets defend the use of French, the independence of Quebec, or denounce intolerance, US hegemony, the federal government, and clumsy privatizations. The problem with missionaries often is that by wanting too much to raise the awareness of the people, they end up stealing a few original ideas from the right too. For example in an 'Antigone,' Locass demands the toughening of laws for criminals. 'Find a left-wing group that writes a track like that!', Biz declared to Le Devoir. They should nonetheless be warned that a left-wing group defending social order through the use of the baton is not doing rap but taking a bad turn." That was in 2005.

Biz: Yeah. Well, I don't know if... I don't know who this guy is, but if it were his child who had been blown up by a bomb in a war... I'm not sure he'd want the guy's sentence to be reduced, you know? I mean: reducing sentences for the "bad guys" in prison is neither left-wing nor right-wing. It’s just human! I find his thing looks a lot like cherry-picking. But no, and look: he’s right to say that fundamentally it’s a right-wing idea, the toughening of sentences for criminals. But I don't see why criminals should... and here we aren't talking about a homeless person stealing an apple at the grocery store! We are talking about organized crime. The bikers in Quebec!

Well, that was in the spring of 2001. You were at the heart of Mom Boucher and it was huge at that time! They literally ruled, you know? They came out... when he came out of the courthouse, we saw the series recently, L'Appel and all that. And then a twist: Batlam embodies the biker leader in the series! Now that he’s become a full-patch himself, it’s funny. But for me, that was it: I had... it’s a text I did and I wanted precisely to condemn the hold that organized crime had on Quebec society. If that makes me someone from the right, I own it. I don't think so, though. And musically: more guitar. Because this text was therefore over "Bon," the reggae at the beginning. It yielded something completely different. So Chaf said: "Well, we're gonna need something more metallic, in connection with the aggressiveness of the tone, of the subject."

Indeed: electric guitar. We are closer to Body Count, actually, than Eminem or Public Enemy. Exact! So we allowed ourselves to go into all genres or sub-genres of rap. It works very well. And live, it was a song that had a tremendous amount of energy that we did toward the end, practically before "Libérez-nous des libéraux." We opened up toward the end. There was a sequence where we did radio bits, integrated a ton of other tracks... a snippet of "L'Assaut" too before coming back to conclude the song. It was a song that lasted sometimes 8 minutes in performance, and in which we incorporated a lot of stuff. And it was extremely energetic! The voices circulate a lot among the three of us too. There is a lot of syllable passing and words... a bit Beastie Boys too? Yeah, that's it! Exact. And it felt good to vent doing that live.

Chapter 25: Libérez-nous des libéraux

Hugo Lachance: Cool. We continue with "Libérez-nous des libéraux."

[Excerpt from Libérez-nous des libéraux: Speech by Jean Charest / René Lévesque]

Hugo Lachance: So, "Libérez-nous des libéraux" which we know well, which rotated massively.

Biz: Yeah. I'm gonna go to the bathroom before talking about it because there’s a lot to say.

Hugo Lachance: We continue with... you don't want us to talk about it? Ah well yes, it’s true! It doesn't bother me. We can skip it. It’s fine, keep going!

Biz: So, "Libérez-nous des libéraux." Well, that’s just it, you know! I think it’s the album's monster track, you know? I think a good album that we love always has a major track at least, you know? This one is "Libérez-nous des libéraux" for all kinds of reasons. It worked well. I think it was in sync with a grievance that it federated, the people dissatisfied with the Charest government. In its delivery, the beat was not bad either, you know? There is something moving forward in the beat. Pretty simple too! There is lilting, foot-tapping for the chorus. It’s a rap track that didn't scare Quebecers who didn't know rap. It’s as if they could recognize themselves: "OK, there is a little bit of foot tapping, a little bit of turlute... OK, he speaks fast but I'm gonna take an interest!" And "libérez-nous des libéraux," I understand, you know?

Yeah, it was perfectly in sync with that audience. Yeah. It’s, you know? And I never thought when we released the album, I never thought it was gonna play on the radio! Because it’s a song that calls for the removal of the government in power. There aren't many countries in the world where that would be possible! That’s true. In many countries, this song would have earned us prison or even death! Let's not hide it. But well, it changed something. They stayed in power for so long! You know: "in a dictatorship it’s 'shut your mouth!', in a democracy it’s 'keep on talking!'" you know?

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But no, but it’s cool that a popular track brings a political edge too, nonetheless.

Biz: Yeah, that's it! That was... there weren't many equivalents. No, I don't think so either. And the timing, as we were saying earlier, was perfect. And look: composed in the fall of 2003, winter 2004, on the baseline of the re-engineering of the Liberal Party of Jean Charest, austerity. Yeah, austerity was more Couillard! That's it. But fundamentally it’s a bit the same thing.

And I remember that was funny: there are so many memories around this track because it’s a track that is major in our career. Probably the most known along with "Le But," for sure. We recorded it in the month of May, we offered it for free on our website. The site crashed because everyone went to download it! After that, the unions grabbed hold of it during the summer of 2004. It swapped the first position back and forth with "Hawaïenne" by Les Trois Accords on CKOI's "6 à 6" countdown! Those were the two tracks of the summer! And look, I was... I remember I was living in LaSalle at that time. I was barbecuing, listening to CKOI and right there, someone says: "Would you like to hear Loco Locass with Libérez-nous des libéraux"... some guy from Sherbrooke there. I was like: "Hey! We made it to the 6 à 6! We became popular!" Whereas before it was in cégeps, universities... we made student music. But here it was like another level, you know? Entering the league of Desjardins, Jean Leloup, Les Cowboys... the arena of popular artists.

So it was the demo version, then! Which was playing on the radio because we were going to record the album in August. So during... and I remember that when we were recording it in August, late August, there was the front page of the Journal de Montréal, it read: "Loco Locass hits big with 'Libérez-nous des libéraux'!" Oh yeah? Right there I said to myself: "But why am I re-recording a number 1 hit? It’s absurd, you know!" And sure enough, to this day, it’s the demo version playing on the radio. Then we re-recorded it, added the federal verse for Paul Martin at the time. We wanted to use the famous: "I am ready! The Liberal Party team is ready! We are ready!" by Jean Charest at the leaders' debate. I remember being in the studio, I call the Quebec Liberal Party. OK? I tell them: "Bonjour! We are a small rap group, we'd like to use a little snippet that Mr. Charest said during the leaders' debate. Is that possible for our music?" He says: "Ah! I'm gonna transfer you to the Legal Department of the Liberal Party."

And that, the Legal Department, means limbo. We never... personally, just the tone there was like: "Forget it! They won't even tell us no, but they're gonna mess with us so much that the album will already be out." So we called Les Zapartistes, who were friends we knew well, and it’s François Parenteau mimicking Jean Charest... the famous "I am ready!" And you can barely tell the difference! But you know, at the end it’s: "I... I prefer Burger King!" And right there, it makes no sense! It goes into total delusion. And it’s Christian Vanasse doing Paul Martin. And it’s so funny what they say, and it fits so well into the spirit of the song! So that’s the version with the federal verse that’s on the album.

Hugo Lachance: Personally, I find it’s close to Eminem too, because there is a humorous side. Yeah, completely! What is that Eminem track? His first single there? "My Name Is," I think it’s pretty close to that. And there is the humor side too, I think, which makes... yes, well yes! We want... we don't agree with the political stances of this government and we say it. But always with a bit of a smirk, sticking our tongue out, you know?

Biz: I think that’s what made it seduce people too. Humor works pretty well, you know? Humorous songs like "Hawaïenne" precisely. But zero politics! We managed to amalgamate the two, which was rather rare. And live, obviously, it was the culminating point of all the shows in the 2000s starting from 2004. People went crazy, fists in the air. And we did it once at the Saint-Jean celebrations in front of 100,000 people. And I said to myself: "100,000 people with their fists in the air, they're gonna take a beating in the next elections!" And they got re-elected anyway. Because in the end, we were preaching to the choir, you know. That’s also the...

Hugo Lachance: Yeah, that's it, exact! You weren't going to seduce other people.

Biz: Well, the Liberal activists, they didn't like the track. Maybe they liked it in secret in their basement, you know! We got a lot of mileage out of it. When they weren't in power—meaning during the PQ interval—and it was the Conservatives at the federal level, we didn't play it! So then we had to completely reorganize our show. "You do a Loco Locass show without playing this track?" Well, you know... people demanded it? Yes, but they understood. We explained it: "We won't play it because it did the job, you know." And that’s like recently, you have Stéphane Archambault who explained that he wasn't doing "Dégénérations" because he had moved elsewhere.

Hugo Lachance: Ah, I hosted him on the podcast too and he tells that story! He says: in fact, when he worked with Joe Grass and Robbie Kuster for his album Point which is truly excellent... I listened to that album all summer long! It’s super good! It’s truly an incredible turn. It wasn't a given. The themes too! For me, it corresponded perfectly to where I was in my life too. It was the same thing, it was: wow! And plus, he says very well during the episode, it’s that he had chosen two anglophone musicians and the rules were that they must not know Mes Aïeux! And he didn't want any violin a priori. Exact! So you see, he wanted to get out of that and it clicked. People understand they want to hear the famous song, but that’s not the point.

Biz: No. And also it’s because it forced us to review our songs. Because at one point, you go from show to show, you make a setlist that works. And then you say: "Well, if it works, we don't change it!" And indeed, the formula is a winner. But at some point, you fall a bit into autopilot. So then you don't do your big track anymore... it had become "La mémoire de Loco Locass" which was the big track at the end. So we moved tracks around and then in the end you... it forces you to say: "Are we the group of a single song too?" It implies all that as a reflection.

But it didn't last long, the Marois government. It was a minority government that lasted 2 years and a half, I think, so they came back quickly unfortunately. But it was... I mean when the piano notes started... paf! People went literally crazy. I remember we played it also in 2012 when we released Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec !. It was during the Maple Spring. And there was at the Francofolies, on the Place des Festivals, a crowd that went all the way to René-Lévesque Boulevard! Laurent, I think, said it was the biggest crowd in the history of the Francofolies. It’s hard to measure those things, but there was an insane amount of people! And we had invited the student leaders Martine Desjardins, Léo Bureau-Blouin, and Gabriel Nadeau-Dubois to come do "Libérez-nous des libéraux" with us. Yeah! I remember that. And the day before, on Thursday, we are rehearsing the show and Laurent Saulnier calls us and says: "You can't do the track." Meaning: not you can't do the track, he says: "The student leaders cannot sing with you."

"What are you talking about, Laurent?" Because Laurent, we knew him! "Damn, Laurent, it’s been 8 years since we heard from Loco. We have a new album. Quebec is in full boil! You're telling us they can't sing with us? What are you talking about?" And you could see he wasn't comfortable and that it wasn't coming from him.

Hugo Lachance: Yes, indeed! Cut off.

Biz: We were literally in a mode of political censorship there! And then I remember hanging up saying: "Tabarnak!" We repeat it for the next day's show and I say: "Well, then we don't do the show! Screw you! You want to censor us? Screw you! We cancel it and explain why." And then Batlam said: "Yeah, but maybe not. Maybe we can do something else. Freedom of expression is dead! We're gonna do a minute of silence in memory of freedom of expression in Quebec." And the leaders, they can come dance on stage but they can't sing. They can't take the floor.

We do the show. It goes super well and at the end the notes arrive, the leaders arrive... right there, Jesus walks on water! And we explain: they won't be able to sing, for example. Right there it’s: "How come?" And then it was tense. So we say: "Well, now we're gonna ask you to sit down and observe a minute of silence in memory of freedom of expression." And Batlam was talking, I was there like: "You want to make 75,000 people sit down? What are you talking about!" And the people start to sit down and they flatten out and they go quiet... and right there you see it! You have 75,000 people in front of you and baf! They sit down and they go quiet. And top chrono: for a minute you hear nothing in Hochelaga in Montreal, except a saxophone playing on another stage much further away! It works. And then afterward we say "Vive le Québec!" And right there we start the track, the people stand up and then it’s madness! The three leaders are dancing with us, they are there. And I think in the end, that silence was more eloquent than anything they could have said. And it was the time where it was like: "OK, now you have a song... this song, this is its moment of glory. It was made for this."

Hugo Lachance: Wow! Truly... it was truly... Personally, honestly, I would cut off my left pinky finger to go back 2 hours before that show, it was so intense. It had been 8 years since we had done anything, we were presenting our new record in the middle of a student strike. It was crazy. But it’s wild to think about that happening in Quebec. You get censored like that for Laurent to call you and say: "They don't sing"? It’s proof also that the government was starting to lose its grip.

Biz: Yeah, well yes! And to dig its heels in. "You want to dig your heels in? Well, we're gonna go there! We won't stop either!" And we were starting to... I say "we," I speak of everyone including Loco Locass, it was starting to become dangerous for the government! Ah yes, absolutely! Because there were marches every single day in the streets on top of it! The weather was beautiful, eh? That year, a mind-blowing spring! And the Canadiens, in support of the students, had decided not to make the playoffs that year. And honestly, that changed everything! Because if we are in a mode of "there's a game tonight," there are fewer people in the street there. It’s true! A playoff game or more. That meant spring occupied everything. The weather was super beautiful. And that moment, for me, is the closest I've lived since the referendum to a large-scale social movement in Quebec.

There was a creativity, an energy of the youth! All the posters were in French with incredible wordplay, no mistakes! There you say to yourself: "It’s not Bill 101 that forces them to make their posters in French. They write in French in the public space because they think French gives them power in the public space!" And that, personally, had rejoiced me to the highest point. Those were clean protests too. Very little mess except when the cops arrived. After that, creativity, ingenuity... we said: "We're gonna be at your service. If you want us to go do a lip-dub or come protest, we'll be there. We support you." There is also the group with the Podcast where "La journée qui s'en vient est flambante neuve" became also an anthem at the protests.

I participated in several rallies, and on the streets, people had loudspeakers blasting "Libérez-nous des libéraux" on loop to accompany us. It’s a beautiful tribute! The track had reached its paroxysm. We couldn't know it, but we did it with that goal in mind for that. It’s a song... the biggest song in our repertoire. No music video! So people spontaneously built their own experience with social images. Each person has their own music video in their head and each person does their own edit. And it lasted, like I tell you: in 2012, it had already been 8 years since it had been written! It was already an old track. And people were still using it. It’s a very beautiful honor, truly.

Hugo Lachance: It’s truly the magic that arrived, as we were speaking earlier, in this case.

Biz: Yeah, you know, it’s in those times you say: it’s worth working on your tracks, a lot! The text, the music, the recording, everything, because it’s gonna survive you, it’s gonna last. Yeah. But there is nonetheless also the moment... something can happen precisely, the magical side. It completely changes direction, that! And you see "Le But" was ready, I think it was ready in 2008 and we waited. Because that year, they got knocked out in the first round quickly. We waited a year! So imagine: we have a cartridge there, we knew it was gonna strike hard there. We have a cartridge that we wait a year before drawing.

Hugo Lachance: How did it go precisely with "Le But"? How do you arrive there? Did the Canadiens contact you or no?

Biz: No! We are the ones who decided to do that for the album Le Québec est mort. We started working on it in 2006, I think. My boy had just been born and I was pushing him in a stroller, rapping verses! For 2 years and a half we worked on the track and that's it: we wanted to talk about this team and its links to the history of Quebec...

Hugo Lachance: But the track entered the Bell Centre nonetheless?

Biz: Yeah! It ends up making it there but not automatically. And I learned recently that they're putting it back into the game NHL 26. Oh yeah? Because when you go to the Bell Centre, it’s the victory track! When they win, the players come greet the crowd and they put on "Allez Montréal!" So since it’s very realistic in the video game, well, they want... when you win with the Canadiens in the video game, you're gonna hear the track.

Hugo Lachance: Wow! We hope for some good royalties on that?

Biz: Ah well look! It’s very little. It’s a license! They give us 3,000 bucks split by 4. So that’s what it gives me: a bit more than 500 bucks.

Chapter 26: Engouement

Hugo Lachance: OK! Come on, we continue, we have left "Engouement."

Biz: "Engouement." There! The transitions in this album are all that, he worked so hard there! In each track there is a transition, one leads to the other.

[Excerpt from Engouement]

Biz: So well the three of us! It closes the album, the three of us rap on it. It’s a chorus Chafiik makes which is truly a play on words. A lot of energy live by accelerating! It’s one of the tracks at the end that sets the place on fire once again! A little Arabic-flavored melody too. So music that is pretty stripped down too, typical of Chafiik's genius there. We have... I have a verse and the other two have two verses, I think. We pass a lot of words back and forth. It’s true, it’s very, very energetic. You know, it’s a track that is festive, you know? We have fun with words in this song, truly.

And at the same time, there is a message always about independence too, about freedom, to... it closes the album on a pretty festive note because we passed through several states of mind, we could say, several types of energy. And that, the energy on which we wanted to leave people, is: yeah! You get the impression that something is coming. Something that’s coming, you know? Which announces another album? But 8 years later! That wasn't planned. But you know if you leave people after the show with this song, it’s: go away on this energy! Yeah, it doesn't end on slows? No, that's it. And we don't turn on the lights to put you out, you know? It’s more... we kind of called for sociopolitical action during the album but: go to it!

Hugo Lachance: OK! Ah, that’s good. I love how you thought out the order of the tracks. You have to take into account so many parameters: the keys of the songs, the rhythms of the songs. You can't have four songs in a row where it’s Biz who did the text and all that, all that. You have to alternate a ton of things! And you have to tell a story too, you know? But it’s an album that is formidable to rediscover. For me, it had been a long time since I listened to it and I truly had pleasure analyzing it.

Biz: That’s where the vinyl release comes in handy! Because those who love music for real and who don't just love one track in a playlist, but who love a story... well, the vinyl is gonna tell you the story in the right order. No, I think it’s good. Can't wait to have it!

Chapter 27: SEGMENT: Rafales

Hugo Lachance: We went through the album! Yes! A short final lightning round segment. What’s your top 3 for the album?

Biz: Ai, ai, ai! That commits to nothing! It’s hard because there are tracks on which I participated, tracks where I don't participate... so is it my ego, my royalties and all that? Besides, regarding royalties, we solved the problem: we are all split in three! So when "Groove Grave" plays on the radio, I get cash even if I did nothing on it. That solved a lot of problems at the root.

The top 3... I’d say: "Groove Grave" certainly. Certainly "Groove Grave." No choice but to say "Libérez-nous des libéraux" because it’s the big hit. Then I’d hesitate perhaps between "La Bataille" and "Résistance."

Hugo Lachance: For me it’s: 3, "La Survenante"; 2, "Groove Grave"; 1, "Maison et idéal."

Biz: We don't have the same choices at all! That’s good, so much the better, because there’s something for every taste. Exact!

Hugo Lachance: Your song... the song that best represents this album, it’s a gateway?

Biz: This album: "Libérez-nous des libéraux." Someone who has never listened to Loco, it’s... it’s a no-brainer! It’s good. There are people who only know us because of that! Then it’s precisely the gateway toward other things. The best song live? "Libérez-nous."

Hugo Lachance: And the track you like the least? If you had one to remove, which would it be?

Biz: Look, on the album, I’d say perhaps "Engouement"... not live, though! I find live it’s better than on the album, let's say. On the album, I find it a bit slow, let's say.

Hugo Lachance: And in closing, what makes you happy about this album?

Biz: Well, I think you said it earlier: it’s the fact that it wins. It’s an album that wins by being listened to 20 years later, you know. We had fun with it during our youth years there. We are 50 years old... but we can listen back to it and you know, we went through it fast there! And for me, I have it especially in headphones. I think it wins by being listened to in headphones. It’s so cliché to say that, but I think it has aged well. I think so, yes. And it says something unfortunately about Quebec. It says we haven't advanced much.

Hugo Lachance: Oh yeah? You think so? OK.

Biz: Oh yeah! If the tracks are still relevant for the most part, things haven't moved much in Quebec. It’s like a photo but unfortunately one that stayed in time. So much the better for Loco Locass but so much the worse for Quebec in a certain way. But yeah, I think the idea of being festive—the Manifestif side—is found in there too. It’s cool! It’s the best we could do at the age we were. And that, for me obviously, personally, it’s associated with many memories in my personal life. The tour... that’s where we exploded with the fans too. And besides, when we presented this album because "Libérez-nous des libéraux" had rotated all summer long in 2004. Then in October 2004, we went to Tout le monde en parle. Because on the strength of the success of "Libérez-nous des libéraux," the album comes out... "Who are these guys?" We must host them!

It was the first year of Tout le monde en parle, so it was a few months after we had pulled Raël's hair with Chaf! Listen, there were nearly 2 million people listening to that in Quebec! You remove the people in comas, the Anglophones, and the old gentlemen, you have pretty much everyone. And so we get invited, we go through the interview. At the time, it used editing. On Thursday the shoot, so we go do the shoot. The record was on sale on Wednesday. It came out on Wednesday, on Thursday we go do the shoot for Tout le monde en parle. It goes well. We had told ourselves, we had a kind of game plan: "We have to be real. We have to have fun. We have to rap!" And that’s exactly what we did. We rapped little a cappella snippets, you know, to...

So the shoot takes place, it goes well and the broadcast is Sunday. And when we talk about magic there... well, the chemistry, that you can predict because you're the one who made it there! You're the one mixing the elements. But the magic is that on the set, at the same time as us, there was an actress who came to present a film about New France with Gérard Depardieu. And to talk about the film, the show had decided to do a quiz on New France. So we separated the two teams face-to-face with buzzers. And on the other side, I remember, there was Michel Rivard who was there. Which was nonetheless a big heavy hitter! The rest of us had winter hats, we were 30 years old at the time, but we were nonetheless considered young. And for me, New France, it happens that I love it and I have a good memory.

So I answered every single question there! [Bruit de buzzer] Biz: Quebec! [Bruit de buzzer] Biz: Champlain! [Bruit de buzzer] Biz: Intendant Talon! [Bruit de buzzer] Biz: 1642!... you know, I knew everything! Those were very simple questions from Grade 10 history, but I remembered them. And that made it so there were 2 million people saying: "OK! They have beanies, their jeans drop a bit too low, but they know their history." And: "Maybe they aren't as dumb as they look!" And right there, for the parents, it kind of legitimized: "I have a teenager who loves rap... he bought this, OK."

So that when the show came out on Sunday, it was broadcast... on Monday I had to go buy a wire on Saint-Hubert Street in Montreal. I take the metro and right there on Sainte-Catherine Street, at every street corner I pass, I get stopped! "Oh yeah? Hey! We saw you on TV yesterday! Hey! It was good what you did! Hey! Michel Rivard, you know your history more than him?" And right there I was like: "OK! Now we took another level there." Now we're... it’s no longer in cégeps that we get recognized, it’s in the street! It’s everywhere: by adults, by the younger ones. And that was the whole fall. After that, heading into winter, we released "Bonzaïon" in the spring! And right there, it took off! Right there we were selling them by the shovelful. On Monday after the end of the day, there was no record left anywhere in Quebec! Re-print! And right there we became a popular group: 50,000 records, Gold Record!

Hugo Lachance: Ah yes, I even bought two of those, Amour Oral! And aren't you gonna buy the vinyl version too?

Biz: It’s the life cycle, but you know, that’s it. That show, Tout le monde en parle, carried us. Through "Libérez-nous des libéraux" all summer on the "6 à 6," it made us take off in the public space. After that, the tour dates went completely on their own everywhere! And right there you guys made it, like you truly entered the musical history of Quebec. You are truly part of... after that that’s it: there are all kinds of charts, groups, songs. It’s a timeless album that is gonna be fixed in the history of music in Quebec, for sure.

And well, I think it witnesses to something in Quebec that happened in the early 2000s. That’s to say essentially, we were part of a movement of renewal of the political song! With Vulgaires Machins, Mononc' Serge, Mes Aïeux, Les Cowboys... in the... see, I put it by decades, Quebec music. In the 70s, it’s songwriters. Félix Leclerc with the Parti Québécois accompanying the independence movement. Then the '80 referendum: everyone is depressed. Electronic drums, we sing in English (The Box and all that). The 90s: we return with the social element. Not political, but social: Vilain Pingouin, Jean Leloup, Les Colocs. And early 2000s there, it’s political! Until 2010 where right there you have rap within rap arriving, Franglais... artists disengage politically. And there it’s Canada that becomes cool. Quebec which is old-fashioned, racist among the youth, perceived like that, I insist.

Whereas when we started, it was Canada that was lame for the youth! Back then, the Quebec flag was what was coolest! Then after the 2020 pandemic there, with Kinkead and others... Lou-Adriane Cassidy, all that... the idea of independence returns among the artists!

Hugo Lachance: So it’s cyclical by decades?

Biz: Apparently! And that rejoices me! Because we participated in it in our own decade. But now it’s no longer our decade. It’s no longer up to us to do that. So our bruised arms hold out the microphone to you! We often get told: "Do shows! Do tracks!". But it’s up to the younger ones to do it now! The rest of us did the job when we were 20 years old. Personally, I want to listen to those kids, go see them live, accompany them, endorse them. I see that my own kids take an interest also in this movement. I rejoice completely. So much the better! It’s true, so much the better for everyone.

Hugo Lachance: And well... we end on this?

Biz: Yeah. We would have a long time left to talk!

Hugo Lachance: Well yes, listen. Next chapter: Le Québec est mort, vive le Québec ! That would be cool! It could do it album by album. Thank you very much, Biz!

Biz: Pleasure.

Hugo Lachance: And yes, we'll do this again for another episode. Thank you to you listeners! Thank you to Hopéra. If you want to support the podcast you know what to do, it’s in the links or on lalbum-podcast.ca. Listen, thanks again! And we'll meet again for another episode of L'Album Podcast!